ACT Policing encourage private investigations?

LusciousLiv 8 December 2011 64

I recently discovered that ACT Police expect me to do my own investigating into the theft of my vehicle. They have instructed me to contact Westfield Woden and ask into security camera footage of the gated carpark from which my car was stolen last Sunday evening. I reported the theft to ACT Police immediately over the phone, and then walked to Woden cop shop (as it was the only place open and warm at that time of night) to finalise the report and wait for a cab home.

Two days later I called the ACT Police general phone number (131 444) again to follow up on any progress with my job #. I mentioned to the officer that there would probably be some kind of CCTV or security camera footage available, as the car was parked in a gated/secure carpark. He put me on hold to check if there were any Police CCTVs in there area (which there aren’t) and then said that I would need to contact Westfield Woden myself to chase up whether the carpark has a camera and if there was any useful footage.

When I queried if it was my responsibility to follow up possible security camera footage of the crime, and to – in effect – conduct my own investigation to uncover additional information pertinent to the crime, he responded in a lacsadaisical fashion that “if we followed up every car theft, we’d be on the phone to security companies all day long”.

I was dumbstruck. I wondered, is that not part of their job?  – to look into crimes and liaise with other bodies who may have information pertinent to said crimes? Surely …!?

(Prologue: The vehicle was located today in Mildura (Victoria) 3 days later, thanks to the proactive approach of Victoria Policing, who noticed the car on the highway, driver and passenger hiding their faces, 2 school age small children in the back seat, (stolen ACT rego plates) and got suspicious. The family of 4 had been living in the car for the past 3 days, and were heading to Perth. The driver (who has an extensive record in WA, NSW and ACT but not VIC) was charged with entering the state with known stolen goods, and was sentenced today to 14 days imprisonment in a Melbourne jail.

ACT Policing will presumably (hopefully) issue a warrant, so that, if the adult drivers return to the ACT they may be apprehended. (It was too minor a crime to bother with extradition apparently.) VIC Policing will also issue a DHS notification so that, whatever state they end up in, DHS might be able to follow up to check if the 2 small kids are ok.)


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64 Responses to ACT Policing encourage private investigations?
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NoImRight NoImRight 10:33 am 30 Dec 11

Tooks said :

Hey fgkz, you wrote the book on predictable. BTW, I can only read your responses when I’m not logged in. Once logged in I can read posts without having to read your pathetic dribble. So if you direct a comment to me and I no longer respond, you’ll know why.

It can be difficult to avoid idiots in life, but with the blacklist function, it makes it easier to avoid idiots on this site at least.

Youre an angry, angry person arent you. You seem to see your main function as bagging others rather than actually saying anything towards a topic.Just name calling isnt an actual contribution you know.

Instant Mash Instant Mash 10:46 pm 29 Dec 11

In my opinion, it is the job of the police to follow up a car theft; regardless of the car itself. I would hardly consider being told to investigate it myself as them serving the public.

I remember several occasions where I had to call the police for drunks trying to break our windows and start fights (overnight work) and them just plain not showing up.

My point is, what the hell is taking up so much of their time that it is seen as acceptable to leave the public to our own devices in potentially dangerous situations that THEY are trained and prepared to deal with? And on that note, if someone was to take the law into their own hands, where are the police gonna stand on that?

Kuku Kuku 9:44 pm 29 Dec 11

Tooks said :

dazzab said :

The_Bulldog said :

Resources are thin.

Really? Have you seen today’s Canberra Times? According to the article about their ‘CSI’ team they have the time to take forensic evidence from 80% of crime scenes and enjoy greater resources than other states/territories.

Um, you do know the difference between police officers (who investigate crimes) and forensic services (collection of forensic evidence), don’t you?

Do you ‘Champ’?

Kuku Kuku 8:52 pm 29 Dec 11

Tooks said :

dazzab said :

The_Bulldog said :

Resources are thin.

Really? Have you seen today’s Canberra Times? According to the article about their ‘CSI’ team they have the time to take forensic evidence from 80% of crime scenes and enjoy greater resources than other states/territories.

Um, you do know the difference between police officers (who investigate crimes) and forensic services (collection of forensic evidence), don’t you?

Name calling. So predicable. And I’m sure you know the difference between pass off and impersonate Tooks. Or maybe you don’t? Be careful ‘Champ’.

Tooks Tooks 8:09 am 25 Dec 11

dazzab said :

The_Bulldog said :

Resources are thin.

Really? Have you seen today’s Canberra Times? According to the article about their ‘CSI’ team they have the time to take forensic evidence from 80% of crime scenes and enjoy greater resources than other states/territories.

Um, you do know the difference between police officers (who investigate crimes) and forensic services (collection of forensic evidence), don’t you?

Tooks Tooks 7:56 am 25 Dec 11

sepi said :

If the security footage is always so useless, then why are police both southside and northside sending people off to try to get hold of it when their cars are stolen?

I would imagine it’s the civilian operators sending people to get CCTV footage, since they are unable to do investigate it.

Tooks Tooks 7:48 am 25 Dec 11

Kuku said :

Tooks said :

Lookout Smithers said :

I would encourage anyone but Canberra Police to investigate anything criminal. Especially if it is serious. That bunch provide anything but a forensic analysis. Never mind uniformed ones, they are even worse.

I rate that trolling effort a D-. And that’s being extremely generous.

Tragic that an alleged ‘serving member’ feels the need to react to members of the public in this manner. Certainly does not enhance the ACT Police reputation on this site and the predictable response complete with name calling.

What’s this – my very own RA stalker? The only person alleging I’m a serving member is you – I’ve certainly never announced my employment (whatever that may be) on this site. Thanks for being as easy to wind up as ever though.

If someone wants to make an obvious trolling effort (as Lookout Smithers did), I doubt he’d be too upset at being called a troll. Welcome to the internet champ. It’s a serious business.

dazzab dazzab 10:49 pm 24 Dec 11

The_Bulldog said :

Resources are thin.

Really? Have you seen today’s Canberra Times? According to the article about their ‘CSI’ team they have the time to take forensic evidence from 80% of crime scenes and enjoy greater resources than other states/territories.

sepi sepi 9:42 pm 24 Dec 11

If the security footage is always so useless, then why are police both southside and northside sending people off to try to get hold of it when their cars are stolen?

Kuku Kuku 7:39 pm 24 Dec 11

Tooks said :

Lookout Smithers said :

I would encourage anyone but Canberra Police to investigate anything criminal. Especially if it is serious. That bunch provide anything but a forensic analysis. Never mind uniformed ones, they are even worse.

I rate that trolling effort a D-. And that’s being extremely generous.

Tragic that an alleged ‘serving member’ feels the need to react to members of the public in this manner. Certainly does not enhance the ACT Police reputation on this site and the predictable response complete with name calling.

WifiDeTech WifiDeTech 4:50 pm 24 Dec 11

Having been on the receiving end of a several crimes now, most of them this year, I agree that police resources are not keeping up with the growth of crime in Canberra. The police do a fantastic job given their resources and their salaries, but it seems that they simply have too much crime to contend with now a days: internet crime, international crime, white collar crime along with the more familiar crimes to us all. The sad fact seems to be that the more professional the criminal organization coupled with their seemingly subtle or difficult to prove crimes, the less likely police will allocate any of their limited resources to it. As a prudent, vigilant person compelled to learn more about crime prevention and detection, I can say from my experience that criminals work in gangs these days, some highly trained and equipped so we need to fight and prevent crime, not on the individual level but as a community..

Tooks Tooks 9:31 am 13 Dec 11

Hey fgkz, you wrote the book on predictable. BTW, I can only read your responses when I’m not logged in. Once logged in I can read posts without having to read your pathetic dribble. So if you direct a comment to me and I no longer respond, you’ll know why.

It can be difficult to avoid idiots in life, but with the blacklist function, it makes it easier to avoid idiots on this site at least.

fgzk fgzk 9:13 am 13 Dec 11

I rate your response “P”, for predictable.

Tooks said :

Lookout Smithers said :

I would encourage anyone but Canberra Police to investigate anything criminal. Especially if it is serious. That bunch provide anything but a forensic analysis. Never mind uniformed ones, they are even worse.

I rate that trolling effort a D-. And that’s being extremely generous.

Tooks Tooks 9:01 am 13 Dec 11

Lookout Smithers said :

I would encourage anyone but Canberra Police to investigate anything criminal. Especially if it is serious. That bunch provide anything but a forensic analysis. Never mind uniformed ones, they are even worse.

I rate that trolling effort a D-. And that’s being extremely generous.

Lookout Smithers Lookout Smithers 7:22 am 13 Dec 11

I would encourage anyone but Canberra Police to investigate anything criminal. Especially if it is serious. That bunch provide anything but a forensic analysis. Never mind uniformed ones, they are even worse.

Classified Classified 2:13 pm 10 Dec 11

Tooks said :

jcitizen said :

DUB said :

LusciousLiv said :

What I have learnt from this is that reporting the theft of a car to the Police is not enough.
You also need to :
– report the theft to the carpark security operators
– notify the car registration authority, so that the rego will come up as de-registered if it does get scanned by one of the RAPID scanners.
– notify the local police station so they can alert their patrol cars in the area.
(None of the above is done automatically by the central Police after you report the theft. All they do, it seems, it issue job numbers for insurance purposes.)

You could also notify the taxi companies so the can keep their eyes peeled while out on the roads, in case they spot it in use or dumped.

Congrats on the recovery of vehicle!
And thanks for the info.
I too, was surprised to learn that after my car and several others were hit at work car park (broken windows, nothing taken, we prevent the crimes that way), ACTP refused to turn up to take fingerprints (even after question by us “What if it could be someone known to police, if you have the prints already?”).
Instead, we only had incident report numbers for insurance. F–ing lame, if you ask me.
But I will remember the point about notifying RoadsACT, so they de-register car, if it is ever stolen.I thought that ACTP would have shared that info with RUS. 🙁

Its not surprising to me.
I know of a Toyota Landcruiser that was torched in a front yard. The Police actually turned up to the address and The duty seargent, seargent Baker, actually yelled at Victim, while the vehicle was still engulfed in flames, “whos the F–kwit, its not my truck thats burning” and drove off. No crime scene was established. The investigating officer questioned the Victim for several hours untill it was revealed that the car was not insured and at that time he simply closed his notebook and was then not interested at all in investigating the matter further.
Although it was reported to Police previously that threats had been made, by the Victims ex girlfriend to torch the car and the ex had been boasting after the event that she and others had torched it, Police refused to charge her, in fact, they actually then hired her.
Internal Investigations were then involved and concerning the complaint against the duty seargent Baker, their response was that he could not even be questioned about his conduct as he had been transfered to Christmas Island.

So no, im not surprised.

Wow, you have some cool stories. Please, tell us more. Don’t type too loudly though, or masked police will kick down your door and insert another tracking device in your skull.

Reminds me of a time I was pulled over by a cop, who was wearing a balaclava. He told me I was doing 60.5kmh in a 60 zone. When I said ‘okay’ he pointed a gun at my face and said “stop gobbing off, smartarse.” He threatened to rape my cat, before spitting on my windscreen, weeing on my front tyres then running off laughing.

This was in Tuggeranong, right?

Tooks Tooks 12:08 pm 10 Dec 11

jcitizen said :

DUB said :

LusciousLiv said :

What I have learnt from this is that reporting the theft of a car to the Police is not enough.
You also need to :
– report the theft to the carpark security operators
– notify the car registration authority, so that the rego will come up as de-registered if it does get scanned by one of the RAPID scanners.
– notify the local police station so they can alert their patrol cars in the area.
(None of the above is done automatically by the central Police after you report the theft. All they do, it seems, it issue job numbers for insurance purposes.)

You could also notify the taxi companies so the can keep their eyes peeled while out on the roads, in case they spot it in use or dumped.

Congrats on the recovery of vehicle!
And thanks for the info.
I too, was surprised to learn that after my car and several others were hit at work car park (broken windows, nothing taken, we prevent the crimes that way), ACTP refused to turn up to take fingerprints (even after question by us “What if it could be someone known to police, if you have the prints already?”).
Instead, we only had incident report numbers for insurance. F–ing lame, if you ask me.
But I will remember the point about notifying RoadsACT, so they de-register car, if it is ever stolen.I thought that ACTP would have shared that info with RUS. 🙁

Its not surprising to me.
I know of a Toyota Landcruiser that was torched in a front yard. The Police actually turned up to the address and The duty seargent, seargent Baker, actually yelled at Victim, while the vehicle was still engulfed in flames, “whos the F–kwit, its not my truck thats burning” and drove off. No crime scene was established. The investigating officer questioned the Victim for several hours untill it was revealed that the car was not insured and at that time he simply closed his notebook and was then not interested at all in investigating the matter further.
Although it was reported to Police previously that threats had been made, by the Victims ex girlfriend to torch the car and the ex had been boasting after the event that she and others had torched it, Police refused to charge her, in fact, they actually then hired her.
Internal Investigations were then involved and concerning the complaint against the duty seargent Baker, their response was that he could not even be questioned about his conduct as he had been transfered to Christmas Island.

So no, im not surprised.

Wow, you have some cool stories. Please, tell us more. Don’t type too loudly though, or masked police will kick down your door and insert another tracking device in your skull.

Reminds me of a time I was pulled over by a cop, who was wearing a balaclava. He told me I was doing 60.5kmh in a 60 zone. When I said ‘okay’ he pointed a gun at my face and said “stop gobbing off, smartarse.” He threatened to rape my cat, before spitting on my windscreen, weeing on my front tyres then running off laughing.

earthrepair earthrepair 11:38 pm 09 Dec 11

Not sure why you are complaining. The Police collectively did their job and tracked the vehicle. The information re CCTV footage is barely relevant as you knew the vehicle had left the car park. You did secure the vehicle (took reasonable measures – for insurance purposes) but if you purchase a steering lock when you park an old car at night you could help a repeat of the situation. Prevention being better than cure?

thatsnotme thatsnotme 11:24 pm 09 Dec 11

Mental Health Worker said :

“I’m sure policing work would have to be part of that big drop.”

So the original poster and others are lying when they said police didn’t investigate their car thefts?

Huh?? How on earth do you come to the conclusion that me believing that the police had something to do with a reduction in car theft equates to me believing that the OP is lying about the police response when their car was stolen? That just makes no sense at all. Quite clearly, cars are still stolen in the ACT, but a less than enthusiastic response to investigating a theft does not mean that the police do no work towards reducing the incidence of theft. That’s just logic 101.

Or on what basis are you “sure”? Trust?

Yes, in fact that is the basis of my belief. Whether a targeted effort to stop car thieves, or a serial offender or two finally getting some time behind bars, I believe that our police force does actually try to prevent property crime. On what basis do you question my assumption?

Let me predict the future. When car (or any) crime rates increase ACT Policing will blame someone or something else. When they fall, they will take the credit. It’s what all police agencies (and government agencies) do, and their claims need to be treated with a certain amount of scepticism.

The fall from 2009-10 to 2010-11 is so large as to be extremely suspicious. And it will be most interesting to see if it is maintained.

I’ll admit that the reduction in numbers is dramatic, and there’s the possibility that there’s an error in the figures. And yes, it will be interesting to see whether the figure is maintained. As for the issue of credit, you seem to be willing to give us a pretty good practical example of that. If the numbers are in fact correct, will you admit that police work is a part of the reduction, or will you continue to question their role?

This is Criminology 101, and clearly no-one here has studied it.

Including yourself, apparently.

By the way, I didn’t say car crime rates aren’t reducing (the statement “Car theft rates will never reduce unless the police actively investigate them” is obviously rhetorical and anyway its tense refers to the future, not the past or present) – anyone familiar with what happened in WA when immobilisers became basically compulsory (for new cars, and all used cars sold) would know that it’s really easy to reduce car crime. And now many thefts of cars throughout Australia are conducted by first breaking into the house and stealing the keys.

This just makes no sense at all. There’s nothing rhetorical about that statement, unless what you actually mean by that is that you’d rather people didn’t challenge your claims. It’s as rhetorical as me saying ‘I’m sure policing work would have to be part of that big drop’. Which is to say, not really rhetorical at all.

As for your statement being the future tense, that makes even less sense. Did the past just not happen? Or are you choosing to wipe the slate clean, and you’re only interested in what happens from now onwards?

Here endeth the PhD thesis. And people called me ignorant. Ha ha.

MHW

If the shoe fits…

TheDancingDjinn TheDancingDjinn 10:59 pm 09 Dec 11

jcitizen said :

DUB said :

LusciousLiv said :

What I have learnt from this is that reporting the theft of a car to the Police is not enough.
You also need to :
– report the theft to the carpark security operators
– notify the car registration authority, so that the rego will come up as de-registered if it does get scanned by one of the RAPID scanners.
– notify the local police station so they can alert their patrol cars in the area.
(None of the above is done automatically by the central Police after you report the theft. All they do, it seems, it issue job numbers for insurance purposes.)

You could also notify the taxi companies so the can keep their eyes peeled while out on the roads, in case they spot it in use or dumped.

Congrats on the recovery of vehicle!
And thanks for the info.
I too, was surprised to learn that after my car and several others were hit at work car park (broken windows, nothing taken, we prevent the crimes that way), ACTP refused to turn up to take fingerprints (even after question by us “What if it could be someone known to police, if you have the prints already?”).
Instead, we only had incident report numbers for insurance. F–ing lame, if you ask me.
But I will remember the point about notifying RoadsACT, so they de-register car, if it is ever stolen.I thought that ACTP would have shared that info with RUS. 🙁

Its not surprising to me.
I know of a Toyota Landcruiser that was torched in a front yard. The Police actually turned up to the address and The duty seargent, seargent Baker, actually yelled at Victim, while the vehicle was still engulfed in flames, “whos the F–kwit, its not my truck thats burning” and drove off. No crime scene was established. The investigating officer questioned the Victim for several hours untill it was revealed that the car was not insured and at that time he simply closed his notebook and was then not interested at all in investigating the matter further.
Although it was reported to Police previously that threats had been made, by the Victims ex girlfriend to torch the car and the ex had been boasting after the event that she and others had torched it, Police refused to charge her, in fact, they actually then hired her.
Internal Investigations were then involved and concerning the complaint against the duty seargent Baker, their response was that he could not even be questioned about his conduct as he had been transfered to Christmas Island.

So no, im not surprised.

While i am usually one to prop ACT Police, i have to agree that sometimes they don’t look like they actually give 2 shits about the crime that has upset you. I have had someone come to my home say to my face ” im gonna F your car up” then 4 am the next morning the people did it, i call the police – they didn’t show up for 2 days.
Another time, a friend of mine calls me at 5 am, she lived 2 streets away and an ex boyfriend of hers kicked open her front door beat her with 2 of his male mates and leaves her in the front yard bleeding badly. When i got there i called the police, they didn’t even show up – didn’t take a report, didn’t do a damn thing.
I like ACT Police, they have always been there in a serious situation when i needed help – but yes sometimes they should try come across sympathetic even if they don’t feel any for the person.

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