Are all Canberrans this unhelpful?

“flavoured” even

Are your CC’s cheese falboured?

missjill said :

Actually, they’re more like CC’s, and they go well with hoummos.

False advertising.. (you must be on RSVP :P)… you said DD *girls*

Don’t lose hope MissJill – Mrs G jsut got back from the shops with Baby G2 and whilst at the check out had the lady in front of her stop to help unload her trolley and the lady who turned up shortly after offered to help carry the bags out to the car.

Two helpful people in the same place – who’d have thunk it.

Hell – it’s the attitude of the person.

I really feel for alone female parents – cause it’s already hard for them and putting other pressures is just boiling point for them.
If they were havin a really bad time I would offer to buy a coffee or help them to the car – no doubt about it.

I’m a female in my mid-20s, no kids and don’t ever want any. I’m not very good with them and don’t find them particularly cute or interesting (though they seem to gravitate towards me for some reason, kind of like how cats gravitate towards people who don’t give them attention). If I was in the young couple’s situation, I probably wouldn’t have reached out to stop your kid, pretty much for the same reasons that others have given. I would have helped you with your groceries once I got to the top level however.

The couple you encountered were jerks, pure and simple (and by the way Thumper, seeing as how they had kids, they aren’t DINKS. You do realise what DINK stands for don’t you?)

As a Dad of a 21 month old adventurous toddler I am subject to her running off in shopping malls on a regular basis. I generally give her a bit of space (couple of meters) to see what she will get up to and stop her from either; getting into a dangerous situation or trashing someones store in her selecting process. Generally she is looking for the first wiggles/bananas car ride or carousel to play on.

I see people stop and go to assist her while looking around for a parent all the time. When they do this I thank them even though their assistance is unnecessary. People when they see a small child standing by themselves focus on the child and don’t always see the parent standing several steps away.

I think a large number of Canberrans will stop and assist a small child running around a shopping mall.

In large gatherings such as Skyfire or the Canberra show writing your phone number on your kids arm is a great way to find them should they run off.

Jazz, just saw your comment above. Please ignore my email, I sent that before I saw your post above. Thank you!

reality skin,

DD’s? What on Earth is that?

Drunken and disorderly?

(thinking, thinking)

aaaaahhh, thooooooose!!

Actually, they’re more like CC’s, and they go well with hoummos.

heeeey madman, that southern gusterly wind was me! No, only kidding.

You know that mother deserves a medal! Even I haven’t attempted the ‘venetians on pram’ manouevre. You deserve a big tick for at least trying to help her before someone else got in before you.

Tell me madman, did you think, “no, I won’t help her, just incase she yells at me, accuses me of being a paedophile, or her bub pulls out a knife?” I don’t think those thoughts ever crossed your mind. Would I be right?

Thank you for for being normal! and have a pleasant weekend.

Jill – I saw something today that reminded me of you… It was the cool gentle breeze against my face. Nah I’m kidding – but I really did see something that reminded me of you.

I was crossing the road from the civic side of Bunda and Corner of Mort Street over to the Braddon side when I saw a young mum with a stroller and some venetians in packaging on top of the pram – she went up this slight incline and of course the packaged venetians fell off – i was trying to cross as fast as I could to help her but this mid-age gentleman who was a public Servane picked it all up and placed it back on the pram – made sure the package was still sealed and asked her if she was alright or if she needed a hand.

That’s a fine citizen!

Roadrage77, Brendan Keilar was the good samaritan that died in Melbourne, one year ago yesterday, at the hands of Christopher Hudson (who you mentioned above).

I agree, Facebook is more exciting than my post/rant/whinge.

Enjoy your weekend.

ihatepublicservants, I didn’t approach anyone as you have stated. I saw them on the way to my car, and I suggested to them that one day it might happen to them. My heart was pounding, I was upset, relieved, frustrated etc etc, and I had just been in a panic situation. Yes, running is a normal part of growing up, but it’s not ‘normal’ to let people get into strife like this, when there was ample opportunity to help me.

I don’t for a moment see how anything I said or did demeans or insults me. You make no sense. You then say that I am “unhelpful”. This also doesn’t make sense – I was the one who needed the help! How does justifiably reacting to a dangerous/awful situation make me unhelpful? Goodness me.

Okay, you can call me an a***hole for reacting, but I can assure you, I am not. I do however suspect that with your new user-name, and your reaction, you may just be one yourself. And incase you’re assuming, I’m not a public servant, most of whom are decent, helpful and switched on people, unlike the two self-absorbed, judgemental juvenile zombies I encountered the other day.

Have a nice, peaceful and stress-free weekend.

missjill said :

Hi, just caught up on the last of couple dozen comments. Thank to all the nice people out there – much appreciated.

Crikey, thank you for letting me know re MJ on 2CC – I missed it.

Roadrage77 said :

No offence lady, but look what happened to Mr. Good Samaritan who intervened during the Christopher Hudson saga in Melbourne last year. He is brown bread. For all I know your daughter could have been concealing a knife…. or worse.

Roadrage77, if you read my entire post, I actually mentioned Brendan Keilar and asked for people to spare a moment for him. Also, my daughter is two and I’m a responsible mother. So please, rest assured, she doesn’t go around carrying knives, machetes, 870 shotguns, toys or otherwise.

DnD, 🙂

You got me – I only read the first sentence or so of your post before I lost concentration and went back to facebook.

Pardon my ignorance, but who the hell is Brendan Keilar?

As I got downstairs, I saw the same young couple. I said “One day that might just happen to you and you’ll want help.” The young man replied by saying “We don’t have naughty kids”. I replied by saying “It’s normal for toddlers to want to run. You probably don’t realise that it’s a normal part of growing up”.

Yes, they were annoying a***holes but so were you. A polite, nice person does not then approach the couple and whine about the fact they didn’t help. Even if you do, that’s all right – you were irritated. But then the part about not realising that it’s a normal part of growing up demeans and insults yourself more than them!

Are all Canberrans this unhelpful? Well you and that couple are, only 300,000 more to check.

Summary:
Them – capital a***holes
You – also a bit of an a***hole

Hi, just caught up on the last of couple dozen comments. Thank to all the nice people out there – much appreciated.

Crikey, thank you for letting me know re MJ on 2CC – I missed it.

Roadrage77 said :

No offence lady, but look what happened to Mr. Good Samaritan who intervened during the Christopher Hudson saga in Melbourne last year. He is brown bread. For all I know your daughter could have been concealing a knife…. or worse.

Roadrage77, if you read my entire post, I actually mentioned Brendan Keilar and asked for people to spare a moment for him. Also, my daughter is two and I’m a responsible mother. So please, rest assured, she doesn’t go around carrying knives, machetes, 870 shotguns, toys or otherwise.

DnD, 🙂

At the risk of sounding like an advert on RSVP, I’m 30s, glossy brown hair, size 12, 12DD “girls”, and I wore stylish jeans, pink cardy, black boots and a touch of make-up. Is that a yummy mummy? Maybe not your regular Pamela Anderson, but, then again, I can build a rabbit pen and my boobs are real.

Thats gold..right there

He’s on 2CC…1206 on the AM dial.

Be assured, the majority of Canberrans would help out, you just hit on the minority

No offence lady, but look what happened to Mr. Good Samaritan who intervened during the Christopher Hudson saga in Melbourne last year. He is brown bread. For all I know your daughter could have been concealing a knife…. or worse.

I didn’t say Gungahlin was posh – I was stereotyping the stuck up snob….

Gungahlin is posh ?!

Crikey, which station is Mike Jeffreys on? (he asks, ever-so casually suggesting you listen to ninety two point seven at 10am on Sunday (for those not going in the Canada Fun Run)!

Mike Jeffreys raised this story on his radio show this morning.

Overheard….. The ACT population has reached 340,300 and growing by 1.5% annually.

Yeahhh amd you’re definatly a yummy mummy – I’m in my early 20’s and would have stopped, perved… then quickly helped you!!!

I think you got the classic mid-aged stuck up Gungahlin posh-a$$ stereotyped people. They’re just up themselves and wouldn’t think about anyone else in the world – not a care. They don’t even recycle and they burn the clothes they grow out of so as not to help the homeless.

Look on the bright side – you’re kid is okay and your post got soap boxed!

🙂

You just keep doing the fine job of raising your daughter. Her health and wellbeing is what counts. They will find a cure one day for the likes of the two you encounted. Talk to Your Cells

fair call, missjill.

just be aware that men are going to be reticent to show even the best-intentioned interest in someone else’s child. I’m 19 yrs old and absolutely unthreatening, but you won’t catch me going anywhere near your kid short of them trying to climb off a balcony.

I work retail casually and there is a certain ‘look’ of the parent who would rip your arms off if you so much as look at their kid.

As a father of two, I always help when I see anybody hurt or in distress. As for it being a child I’d rather face the wrath of a parent then have an injured, distressed or lost child on my conscience.

If I had been there, I would have helped.

BUT it is highly unlikely I would have grabbed or held your child, because I don’t know what kind of a kook *you* are. I have learned this from bitter experience, when I’ve had to actually *apologise* for helping someone out, perhaps by catching a runaway trolley, or asking a lonesome child if they are lost.

One time at a local shopping centre, I spotted a German Shepherd cornering a young kid who was *obviously* scared mindless. The people standing around were doing *nothing* but watching. I walked up to the kid, grabbed his hand and led him away from the dog (I’ve been that kid before). We stood together, him still crying, about ten metres away. Then his mum came out and had a go at *me*. Explanation meant nothing. Expletives followed from her end.

Just about every day I end up helping someone with something, whether is it a little old lady at Woollies or helping a mum with bags or change etc. It is very disappointing to see how society is dumbing down and the social fabric we once had is fraying away.
It seems to me that it is how we are brought up, and these days there is not much of the good old fashioned way being done unfortunately. Being in my late 40s I am from the old school of do unto others as you would have done to you. Just hang in there, and be true to yourself and pray that there is someone good nearby when things go awry. We are not all evil!!

As a parent with two active kids born 18 months apart, I can definitely vouch for the leash. We used one which strapped around their wrist.

At first we thought that everyone would be looking at us and judging us badly for restraining the child that way but we shortly realised that, on the whole, no-one gave a damn. If anything, they were appreciative that we were prepared to use a practical method of controlling the child.

It also meant that single parent outings to the shops were now practical which certainly improved our (and the kids) quality of life.

Also, given that you are over 10 times more likely to be a victim of paedophilia from your relatives or friends than from a stranger the media beat-up regarding the dangers of strangers and the resulting fear that most adult males (myself included) now have of being wrongly accused is a very poor reflection on society.

ref: Statistics on Child Abuse & Neglect, QLD, 2001-2002

Ah VY confirms claims a few months back that “she” “is hot” were bunkum.

On topic: the best kids get astray from the best parents. The Home Show at EPIC is a classic. Lost 2yo there a year back while talking to vendor – big panic. Lesson learned, the following year she had a label with my mobile number on it plastered to her sleeve. Sure enough – gone again. But found within just 5 minutes this time.

Not raising “a naughty child” my arse, time will tell on that one.
Its okay, you’re a normal parent but the two people you ran into are raising a future hellbitch.

But, not having any two-years olds that I know of, I can’t speak from a parental perspective on this one, only from experience as a deep-voiced bearded guy who occasions shopping centres.

It seems fairly common for single-mothers to ask passers-by to tell their kids to get back into line.
Having been asked a great many times to do it, toddlers don’t seem to know how to effectively deal with strangers saying “Oi. Do as your mother says, and give that back\spit that out\get of the escalator.”
But unless i’m tremendously disrupted by the kid or they’re putting themselves at risk and I can’t see the parent, I won’t do that without being invited.

Some people just don’t give a shi#t, they live in their own world and worry about only themsleves. I am vision impaired and often have both of my boys with me, one is 17 months, the other is four. At times I have both of them testing the boundaries and if I don’t have my cane out, which is often hard with a stroller to do so, no one know’s i have vision problems and yep no one helps. Its a shame we live in a society like this isn’t it.

My only hope is those two wood ducks who scoffed at you, need help one day and every just says nah their your naughty kids you look after them.

http://www.explosm.net/comics/1315/

Gotta love appropriate links…

Hey missjill. Before this sinks away under the weight of later stories, just a quickie to say good on you for putting your two cents in on a topic that you felt/feel passionately about. (I put in my fifth and sixth cents at about 6.30 this morning but I must have used some trigger word as it’s in a moderation holding pattern.)

Enjoy your time with your daughter; shopping mall mishaps aside, two is a wonderful age — everything’s new and they have the powers of speech and intelligence to tell you all about it all. And ask all about it!

This is all so bloody ridiculous. Wanky dinks or no wanky dinks, whatever you want to call yourselves. Anyone could stand at the top of that escalator and block the way without touching the child. There’s no excuse. How would you feel if the kid got seriously hurt? It’s about time you people grew some balls and stopped being so bloody politically correct and do the RIGHT THING for a change.
As for Canberrans being unhelpful? I’d agree with that.
I’ve lost count of the number of times I’ve got up and helped a lady onto a bus with a pram while everyone else (able bodied people), stare out of the window pretending not to notice.

hi all, thanks for your input. Everybody can form an opinion, but it was one of those “you had to be there” moments.

To FC, I can understand your confusion, but the singledom was not planned. The pregnancy was planned. V8 was right.

MODS, if you read this, could you please replace the Featured Post with something else? Budget leaflet maybe? Please. I just want to forget this happened and move on. I do appreciate all the input from Canberrans; you have restored my faith in people in general. Thank you.

[Ed. (Jazz) As soon as i see something worth making a feature of, it will replace this one. Btw i just heard that this thread was made reference to on AM radio thismorning]

blueberry said :

I don’t think that the couple really behave appropriately and they were unnecessarily rude but I depending on the situation probably would not have stoped your toddler unless you had asked, the sad fact is that although a lot of people would help most of they are scared.

I was in a similar situation but from the other side. I was at the CISAC pool with my little sister and little cousin, we were in the kids whirl pool and I saw a little girl who was obviously struggling in the deep water and looked absolutely terrified (I am a swimming instructor at another pool and I can tell by the look on a kids face when they are in trouble in the water).

After having a good look around to see if there was any parent near by to help her I wadded in , asked her if she would like a hand back to the shallow water then held out my hand and walked her back to the shallow water. I didn’t pick her up, actually I barely even touched her I just gave her tow back to where she could stand. And what thanks did I get? After the father had finally noticed what had happened he walked straight up to me and told me “how dare I touch his child” and that I should mind my own business, blah blah blah (expletives removed).

After that I decided that unless asked I would not interfere unless there was extremely imminent danger or I was asked. It’s just not worth the risk.

I understand your pain – I am a first aid trained person, who has seen kids escape from a mummy or daddy laden with shopping, pelt towards the escalator, usually the down one, (buggered if I know why)and manage to get onto it, before tumbling down. I have assisted with rudimentary first aid to ensure that there are:

bandaids used for superficial cuts and scrapes
if the child has fallen badly, I put them in the recovery position if i can, or cover them up with a thermal (foil) blanket and ask their parents to sit with them whilst I call for an ambulance. I don’t move the child if I suspect that they may have injured their back or neck.

I carry a bum bag first aid kit with me on weekends, and over the years, I have assisted 3 or 4 parents with kids who have fallen down the step escalator. If anything, the fact that I wait for the parents to arrive may be the calming factor, A pervert doesn’t wait for parents.

I would prefer to grab the kids prior to them going over – if the parents want to yell at me, it will save me an explanation to an ambulance officer or a centre management official.

Unfortunately, I have been punched twice, but i will still assist the injured if I see that there is a need. I don’t proclaim that I am first aid trained to all and sundry, but instead will ensure that the patient is the first priority, reassuring them prior to their parents arriving on the scene.

I have also assisted Car accident victims, elderly people who have had a fall etc, etc. I am not an ambo, but as i have taken the time to do the training, I won’t look the other way when I see someone in trouble.

I also return wallets to people who lose them – I will check for a credit card or license, but never pay attention to the money inside it, it isn’t mine.

I am a good samaritan. In this day and age, I hope that i do some good, however, my wife is convinced I am going to get myself killed helping someone out. If that happens, so be it.

…there is a difference between ‘wanky’ dinks, or simply dinks….

I’m guessing that the former would be two chaps living together who haven’t come to terms with their homosexuality, the latter would be a couple of any gender with a low IQ.

I thought that this was quite funny – Baby restraint devices:

http://babycage.net/access.php

If the link does not work, just copy and paste into the explorer bar.

I wear the wanker label with pride. 😉

I don’t think that the couple really behave appropriately and they were unnecessarily rude but I depending on the situation probably would not have stoped your toddler unless you had asked, the sad fact is that although a lot of people would help most of they are scared.

I was in a similar situation but from the other side. I was at the CISAC pool with my little sister and little cousin, we were in the kids whirl pool and I saw a little girl who was obviously struggling in the deep water and looked absolutely terrified (I am a swimming instructor at another pool and I can tell by the look on a kids face when they are in trouble in the water).

After having a good look around to see if there was any parent near by to help her I wadded in , asked her if she would like a hand back to the shallow water then held out my hand and walked her back to the shallow water. I didn’t pick her up, actually I barely even touched her I just gave her tow back to where she could stand. And what thanks did I get? After the father had finally noticed what had happened he walked straight up to me and told me “how dare I touch his child” and that I should mind my own business, blah blah blah (expletives removed).

After that I decided that unless asked I would not interfere unless there was extremely imminent danger or I was asked. It’s just not worth the risk.

miss jill, i feel your pain, what arrogant a*seholes! the worst thing unbelievably wasn’t them not helping, but their comment!! they’re probably the same people who don’t know how to correctly merge onto the GDE from the alleged choke points because of their arrogance, and then whinge about how their SUV was delayed five minutes in the peak half hour canberrans think equates to sydney traffic.

I once witnessed an obnoxious kid in a shopping centre who had just kicked his obese mother in shins, he run off in my direction so I grabbed the kid and sent him back to his mother for discipline. She thanked me.

As a “wanky dink” myself, I’ve got to agree with others who have said they wouldn’t touch somebody else’s kid for fear of hostility from the parent (been there, done that). Having said that, I’d gladly help you with your bags, or something like that – just as I’d help you pick up stuff if you dropped it and you DIDN’T have a kid in tow. People with kids have also got to remember that dealing with children doesn’t come naturally to everyone. For some of us wanky dinks, children are strange, foreign little creatures, and we don’t really know how to interact with them (nor care to, which is why we are wanky dinks in the first place). Picking them up, or grabbing them, is likely the last thing we’re going to do.

Good Point VY.
I guess the reference to not being ‘by choice’ may have been referring to the ‘single’ part of it. in which case, as you said, the are examples of it being without choice. I didn’t really think of that.

I was, however, referring to the birth of a child.

Lets try that again

Circa 1946… Va Voom

@FC – my take was that the ‘Single Mother’ element was not the choice, as opposed to the actual having of the child and the OP seems to me to be taking an active responsibility for her life – and the consequences of not only her choices, but the choices of her previous partner too.

As a Canberran due to give birth in not so many days, I am heartened to know that the majority of people who have posted would have helped in some way

Cloris Leachman.

<a href=”http://www.imdb.com/media/rm3866728448/nm0001458″<Circa 1946… Va Voom !!

I would have helped you missjill, at the risk of looking suss.

FC – be careful, there are examples of situations you arrive at without choice, such as the death of a partner.

As an early thirties male, there’s no way I would have touched a stranger’s child. Happy to help pick up the stroller and all, but I’m not laying a finger on your kid. Like others here I seen situations where people try to help, and have judgmental parents (of both genders) say nasty things.

Young master Berlina (who is not quite 3) also used to have a big problem with running off. It was solved by use of the word “STOP”. If he didn’t, he was forced to walk holding hands, and for repeat offences scored a tap on the rump. As if by magic, the problem disappeared. Now he trots along, and occasionally has a wander (which is fine under most circumstances), and stops when told to do so. A little bit of discipline goes a long way. He is two, but he knows damn well when he’s being naughty.

That said, occasionally stuff happens when kids are around, it’s just the way things are. As for the couple on the escalator, they probably don’t have kids. And I think most parents would agree that until you have kids, you really don’t know what it’s like.

First of all I’d like to comment on having a child, “not by choice”, but by circumstances. I am sure what you mean to say is that it was an unplanned pregnancy?
Becuase otherwise, it very much is by ‘choice’.
A choice is made to have sex without protection/contraception.
A choice is made not to get the morning after pill.
A choice was also made not to have an abortion.
It is all about choice.
The choice to, or the choice not to take an active responsibility for your life and the consequences of you choices.

I am sure that you know that anyway, I just had the urge to say that.

that being said, I have been in a similiar situation and have recieved help.
So I guess it is just a matter of who’s around at the time.
I think a lot does have to do with fear of ‘not getting involved in other peoples business’, or something like that.
I definetly would have assisted if I saw a situation as the one described. I do think, however that calling out for help next time might get you more assitance. Although I do notice that many people in shopping centres (and generally in a lot of public places) seem to be completly unaware of what is going on around them, so mabye this lack of awareness is what caused the lack of assistance.

Also, you DEFINITLY don’t deserve to have a complete stranger pass judgment on your child. And you’re right, I’m sure that this couple will be in a situation similar one day, and I’m sure they’ll think back to you and wish they had helped.

I’m not touching someone else’s kid. For all I know, some aggressive parent will punch me in the face over it. You never know what’s coming at you.

Also, I hate touching kids – it’s not my job to control other people’s kids.

I’ve been on the other side of the situation before. Was on a train in NZ once and an inquisitive toddler made a dash for freedom just as the doors were about to shut. Being nearer than the parents of course I reached out to grab hold of him. The parents got there, picked him up, and completely ignored me – not even so much as a nod of acknowledgement. It left me feeling really awkward and uncomfortable for the rest of the ride, as if I’d intruded on their private space.

Since I’m female and early 20s I don’t suppose they could have thought I was a sexual predator. (unless of course if it has to do with me being asian – but that’s a whole other can of worms there.)

Still, unpleasant as that was, I’d do the same if i see a kid in trouble again.

astrojax said :

yep, i agree with missjill, too many people (overheard’s rant about ‘all’ aside) don’t give enough of a fark and that is a sad state of affairs.

Yeah, it was a rant, but sweeping statements about groups of people (not just Canberrans) just frustrate the f*ck out of me. Though missjill, I totally get your regret at the initial phrasing. If I could take back some of the things I’ve said and done, I’d spend half the day in the editing suite. Ah, if only life came with Ctrl+Z.

But after a very wide-ranging debate throwing up myriad points of view, approaches and perspectives, to see an absolute comment like this: ‘Unfortunately society today is inpersonal, everyone acts for themselves’ (bd84) is doubly galling.

If anything, the above 47 posts prove that’s patently NOT the case.

What can you do but shake the head, watch Sweden exit Euro 2008 and start to think about quarter finals. (Ruski Guus vs Nederland — intriguing.)

Damn. There was something else I had to say. What the hell was it? Ah, now I remember.

Swoon!

na, women are just trouble…

Pandy, I’m officially over dating, sorry to disappoint you and the Mrs, but Mr realityskin might be interested, lol.

missjill said :

I’m 30s, glossy brown hair, size 12, 12DD “girls”, and I wore stylish jeans, pink cardy, black boots and a touch of make-up.

Wait, i didn’t read it all…..

no wonder you’re single…

missjill, 12DD like is that big? Like ’em grapefruit size.

Are you dating? Can the missus come along too?

astrojax, sepi, i-filed, illyria, cranky, headbonius, the very funny VicePope and the other nice people, thank you.

peter@home, thank you! I’ll check out toys’r’us this weekend.

bd84, thanks for your balanced comment. I can assure you that my two year old hears plenty of NO’s, but this is next to useless when she sees a new play thing, such as a moving escalator.

danman, if I told you I looked like Phyllis Diller, would you still be swooning? Yes? OK then, I look like Cloris Leachman.

Just standing between the child and the escalator and saying “Hey you better wait for your mum” might have been enough distraction time for you to catch the child. They didn’t even need to lay a hand on your little person. Don’t worry about the two judgemental clowns another minute and well done for your efforts in trying to save your child from harm.

P.s. Hi Mrs Danman, If you’re reading this 🙂

I’m 30s, glossy brown hair, size 12, 12DD “girls”, and I wore stylish jeans, pink cardy, black boots and a touch of make-up.

danman swoons

is it getting hot in here (fanning face)

Ill keep an eye out next time I am at the G 😛

I have seen things this week (new job) which put even touching a strange child in a whole new light. If the parent wants to get nasty, you are in a whole world of trouble. Touching a kid, restraining it, in a public place like a shopping mall can see you charged by the police… they have to submit the evidence to the DPP who then advises them whether to charge the person or not. It’s all dependant on the parent lodging a complaint. If the parent is some addled lunatic, or just having a bad day (well, they’re a parent so there’ll be lots of those), you’re at their mercy.

Two year olds are naughty, inquisative, mischievous, however most learn quickly an understand when mum says NO, they will probably not understand the reasoning behind it. I didn’t say missjill was a bad mother or the child was any different to any other child, was terrible or was growing up to be a bad person because they ran off at the shops, presumably after she had told her not to (hence most would say being a bit naughty?).

there’s not an easy way to fix society not giving a stuff about anything, despite governments trying to fix every problem with a lovely scary ad campaign.

I’m sure there would be a lot more people willing to help in situations like this if they weren’t likely to be accused of anything, get abused or sued for trying to help. I can think of a situation myself where there was a lost child at the shops and they put a call out for sightings, I happened to see said child enjoying himself on one of the kiddy’s rides. Where in the past I may have taken him back to mum at centre management, I walked down to centre management to tell them where he was, just because I would have been accused of abduction had anyone seen me taking the child from the ride.

sad but it’s the world today.

Ok,

as another parent, I have caught toddlers on the rampage, waited till their stressed parents have caught up, and some times have been thanked, others, they look at you like you are a pervert. I will keep on doing what I do. Why? in the slim hope that someone who sees my 3yo heading for the down elevator at high speed will do the same for me.

I have 3 kids, a 3yo and 2 12-month old twin boys. all can now walk.
(insert run, bolt etc, etc)

we have 3 “leashes” in disguise – they are backpack animals, with clips across the shoulders and a “tail” leash. the kids love to wear them as it is like them having a (no joke) monkey on their backs, or a puppy etc.

toys R us carry them, as does kid essentials. worth their weight in gold.

I also feel that as a first aid trained person, if the child falls over and cracks their head open, I need to be able to assist, even though in the occasions that this has occurred, again, I was viewed as a pervert.

society is to blame for this, but we cannot change it as we parents will always be suss of the interested man.

c’mon bd84, ‘naughty’ is a bit too pejorative a term to use here for a two year old, f’god’s sake. a two year old isn’t to understand that running off to explore is ‘naughty’, wrong – and that sorta sums up missjill’s frustration at the world. everything that can go wrong – kids amok, stroller and groceries scattered everywhere and, to top it off, no-one in the world seems to give a flying fox.

like drivers on the roads, no-one seems to give a toss these days about others and how they might be having a bit of a time of it. if a small child runs from a parent who looks exasperated and the stroller and groceries are flung aside, surely it is pretty obvious that parent needs help in corralling the kid – and having one of their own makes their [in]action more reprehensible.

yep, i agree with missjill, too many people (overheard’s rant about ‘all’ aside) don’t give enough of a fark and that is a sad state of affairs.

but what to do about it? education? civics and manners in school, through all grades? might be a start. ads? maybe.

and i don’t even have kids.

its typical really.

I hardly blame the couple, as many people have mentioned that you’re just as likely to get accused of being a paedophile or trying to take the child despite your willingness to help. Also while one of the few that would have accepted the help, many many other parents would more likely abuse you for trying to stop their darling child from doing something than to thank you. You may have got more assistance if the child was in extreme danger and about to run out onto a busy highway, but I’m not surprised there was no help forthcoming for an escalator, it doesn’t shout life threatening danger.

Unfortunately society today is inpersonal, everyone acts for themselves.. sorry not just a Canberra thing, if anything I find here better than a lot of the other large capital cities I’ve visited where you may as well be street furniture.

Anyway, while you probably realise your child was being a bit naughty as every toddler is, your comment to the couple in the first place wasn’t really warranted and then you may not have been told what you already knew.

missjill said :

I couldn’t help but notice that the guy was a skinny rake, and the woman was wider than the GDE. .

yes but the GDE is only two lanes!

Sad that you met two unhelpful people – but they were only two people.

I’m pretty sure I would have just stepped in front of the escalator so your littlie couldn’t hop on – or grabbed her if I could see you coming.

But sometimes it can be hard to act quickly, and the moment is gone, and you are just left thinking that you should have stepped in. Anyway – not everyone is unhelpful.

I do remember thinking when I moved from Melbourne that people seem to keep to themselves more here, rather than chatting to a stranger, or helping to lift a stroller onto a bus etc.

It sounds as though this couple were awful – but sometimes people are wrapped up in their thoughts rather than ignoring a situation. I was accosted by a couple at the Dickson shops a few years ago paying me out for ignoring them – they were visitors and had asked directions. I was on my way home from the funeral of a dear friend – and simply hadn’t heard or noticed them … when I explained they felt mortified and apologised, but of course no-one was at fault. It was actually a good thing that they took it up with me, or they could have assumed Canberrans were rude and unhelpful!

Some of these stories are quite hilarious (in hindsight).

Really, there was ample opportunity for these two people to at least keep an eye on my tipped over stroller, groceries and handbag. And there we have it. Could they have been concerned that I would accuse them of theft? It just goes on and on and on doesn’t it.

Great idea about the leash. I think it’s a goer, that way she can have freedom and I have peace of mind. Thank you. And now for a dose of Spicks and Specks followed by The Gruen Transfer while the rugrat sleeps. A bit of mummy time at last, this time without the adrenalin.

Strangers grabbing/restraining/touching someone else’s young child are unfortunately asking for trouble. If the parent wants to make trouble about it, the law is on their side and the helpful person might be left defending themselves. The parent might just get territorial and abusive.

The idea of restraining a kid with a leash is a good one. they work very well for parents taking their kid skiing, and I remember they were quite prevalent when I was young. If you can’t control the kid’s behaviour in public, something of that nature might be a good idea.

Hi Missjill, don’t feel too bad, the other day my 2 year old knocked over a fully clothed dummy (adult sized) in a clothing store.

I had already said ‘don’t touch” about 20 times before it happened but I only have 1 set of eyes and 1 pair of hands. The child is not what I would call naughty, just very inquisitive and determined.

We got some very judgmental looks from passers by, however the older lady in the shop was very understanding and assurred me that it happens at least once a week. She ended up giving my shocked toddler a lollypop to calm her down!

A man in the shop helped me pick up the dummy and put it back together.

I can assure you that good people are alive and well in Canberra.

I was in a similar position to the dunderheads just yesterday, on a very rare visit to a Mall.

Perhaps VicePopish in appearance, and aged, I was approached by a two year oldish seemingly unsupervised, moving rapidly through the Centre, and enjoying him/herself enormously.

Two thoughts immediately crossed the mind. Do I attempt to distract and slow the progress of the child, with the aim of discovering a minder, or will I appear to be some sort of sexual predator.

Scanning the crowd behind the child, I spotted a male who had apparently allowed the child a long leash – probably 20/30 metres, and had a good eye on the kid.

Problem solved – but the greater appreciation by society of pedophilia has certainly impacted on my, and I suspect a very wide cross section of society’s, way of thinking.

A very unfortunate incident indeed. It appears that you met some of the ‘Smug Clan’ The ‘We are better parents than everyone else’ variety. Ignore them. The majority of people will help. I would have at least picked up your stroller and groceries or possibly intervened in your two year old’s adventure. Sorry you met the smugs.

Woody Mann-Caruso said :

Are all Canberrans like that? Of course not. I’d help you in a heartbeat, and I’d hope you’d do the same for my toddler, and I’d think the couple on the escalator were selfish pr.cks in denial. But invoking Brendan Keilar? Come on. That’s a bit like me invoking Harold Holt when I can’t find my keys.

Sorry mate, I was just pointing out that there are good samaritans in this world, and today being the anniversary of his death and all.

I am a kindly old giant who thinks little children are generically wonderful and who would, I hope, act to prevent a catastrophe. Those who act outrageously are most fun. If the child took a look at my fearsomely grizzled features, he or she might scream, or laugh.

Someone previously has picked up the problem of insularity – we don’t act because it does not affect us. That’s an appalling proposition.

Pragmatically, though, I can see circumstances where a VicePapal monster grabs a child who’s about to kamikaze and some bystander might form the view that the monster is going to kidnap and abuse the child. So some might stand back and wait for others – this is truly unfortunate, but put even a moment’s hesitation down to the effects of the well-publicised efforts of child abusers.

In this situation:
a) I would love to help
b) I would be worried about “complicating” the situation. E.g. if by stopping your daughter I somehow hurt or frightened her

*However*, surely a couple who already have at least one child would have a better idea than I of how to halt a rogue child *and* there is NO EXCUSE for their smarmy comment. If it had been me, I probably wouldn’t have helped (out of fear / not knowing what to do) but I certainly would have apologised afterwards (or made an attempt at humour to at least try and make you feel better about it).

Face it – the couple in question were jerks. Perhaps because they didn’t help but definitely because of their comment.

Thanks everyone, I enjoyed reading all your comments, and everyone has a valid point. Everyone. People seem to be frightened of what they may be accused of, and that’s sad. Sometimes I wish we were living in the 1950s, when things weren’t as complicated and life was more “innocent” in a way.

Overheard, thanks. I understand, but please know that if I could, I would change the title to not include the word “all”. I was pretty angry when I wrote it, and although the facts are correct, the title lacks thought. I don’t for a moment think all Canberrans are unhelpful, sorry, it was really the wrong title. You sound like you’ve done a great job with your kids, and please know that reading your story, and those of the other people who have responded to my post, it certainly shows that Canberrans come through when someone needs a kind ear.

Pandy, regarding your yummy mummy comment. I don’t think that had anything to do with the way these two just walked by. I couldn’t help but notice that the guy was a skinny rake, and the woman was wider than the GDE. At the risk of sounding like an advert on RSVP, I’m 30s, glossy brown hair, size 12, 12DD “girls”, and I wore stylish jeans, pink cardy, black boots and a touch of make-up. Is that a yummy mummy? Maybe not your regular Pamela Anderson, but, then again, I can build a rabbit pen and my boobs are real. I bet you’re sorry you asked.

Apologies in advance if I’ve offended anyone.

Are all Canberrans like that? Of course not. I’d help you in a heartbeat, and I’d hope you’d do the same for my toddler, and I’d think the couple on the escalator were selfish pr.cks in denial. But invoking Brendan Keilar? Come on. That’s a bit like me invoking Harold Holt when I can’t find my keys.

I always keep an eye out for little people on the loose- I’ve helped them find mum or dad and I have stopped one jumping off a stairwell.

I wasn’t born in Canberra though.

Hi missjill. Sorry if I came across a bit harsh with my ‘don’t generalise’ comment. I just get a bit tired of the easy shot of saying ‘all Canberrans/Melburnians/Australians/East Senagalese/Muslims/public servants/Left-handed surfboarders/insert collective of your choice here’ have some characteristic.

You can generalise only so far. Just back from a run, I can tell you that the following statement is probably correct: ‘All runners sweat’. (And if they don’t take a torch in the dark, they may well fall flat on their faces. Pass the betadine…!)

But when you try doing the same with attitudes, beliefs or other actions, then a statement becomes too value-laden. Yeah, if you (correction): if ONE goes looking for an attitude, you’ll find it. If one wants to believe that Canberrans are obnoxious, uncaring, self-centred people, then one can wander around town for long enough and find plenty of evidence to back up that statement.

BUT (and it’s a biggie) to say that ALL Canberrans are that way is a massive slap to (for example) the hordes and legions of volunteers in this fair town who give self-lessly every day and go way beyond the call on behalf of others.

And it also is a slap to the sorts of people (some who’ve posted above) who would have gladly rushed to your child’s aid.

Personally, I’ve had two in the terrible twos, and the first used to throw shopping mall tantrums that used to bring people out of other shops to watch! I’ve seen those acusatory looks.

Were we (me and the now ex) bad parents? No.

Did we let the kids ride rough-shod where they wanted? Definitely not.

You’ve got to give kids boundaries (i.e. don’t jump off that cliff, please don’t pull all the cereal off the shelf), but within those boundaries, kids have got to be kids and as someone said above, explore. What’s a kid doing when it says ‘goo, gaa, burble, barble’? Road-testing its linguistic abilities. What’s a kid doing when it goes for a scoot further than five feet from you? Road-testing its feet and finding out about its world.

At that age, you’ve got to let them wander within reason, just not over the aforementioned cliff.

I’m happy to say my two (now tweenies) are courteous, respectful, creative, knockabout, fun-loving, funny kids who even at their tender ages have, or have had, leadership roles. All of their own volition and their own choosing and their own pace. Kids will make their own decisions, and they’ll own and adhere to the ones they are allowed to run with rather than anything you tell them to do.

So don’t beat yourself up. But don’t beat up ‘society’ (sic) for how its individual members may or may not react either.

And yes, I’d echo above statements that I would be very circumspect about approaching or grabbing another person’s child unless it was in imminent and apparent danger.

Are you a yummy mummy? If not, there is your answer.

Personally I’m with RuffnReady there is no way I’m going to touch your child. It’s generally frowned upon by all mothers when a 20 odd year old males grabs their kids. I would help out with the groceries and ask if you needed a hand however. So in short no, not unhelpful, you just got two p#$%^s who were too smug and amused watching your dilemma to react properly in the situation. Pity they appear to be breeders, I’m sure they’ll have “lovely” children (insert sarcasm).

Tomorrow will be a better day, smile.

The other day in Woden Plaza, I saw a mother with a child (about 10-ish), frantically yelling “Brad, Brad”. I slowed down to make sure Brad turned up. 20 seconds later, 11-ish Brad turns up confused as to the commotion.
Mums reaction – a big hug. Then a calm-ish explanation to explain why that was a bad thing.
Brad was just an older version of the adventurous 2 year old.
I bet those 2 a***holes would have thought that Mum did a bad job letting Brad wander off. But I bet Brad ends up a better human being than either of them.

I probably wouldn’t have helped in that instance, for fear of being yelled at.

However, had you called out something like ‘Stop that child’ (like you said) then I would have known it was fine and I would have stopped the child.

And I probably would have just apologised if I hadn’t helped and had been confronted – them being so judgemental does no good for anyone.

Woolworths’ home delivery: http://www.homeshop.com.au

Yes, I’d like to also underline that the young couple are arseholes for saying what they did. Their kids were probably jacked up on Ritalin because the little ones once dropped a can of baked beans in the kitchen.

You’re kids are not naughty and you’re not a bad parent because of it!

Crap…you should have seen me when I was little. Picture my Mum browsing through DJ’s in Woden when they used to have the big spools of material in the sewing section. I thought it was a sweet idea to hide amongst the big rolls of fabric until my Mum and the store staff were frantic enough. At the perfect time, I jumped out from all the rolls knocking them all over the store (rolling down the escalators and all) and couldn’t realise why I was in trouble. My mum was told at that time I was a naughty child. Probably a fair time to say it in that case. Hey, at least I had spirit as a child and wasn’t half lobotomised unnecessarily with drugs to make me “normal”.

People tend to think everyone else but themselves are bad drivers.
People tend to think everyone else but themselves are bad parents.

It’s human nature to easily criticise, and difficult to praise others. It really should be the other way around.

I admire anyone who is raising kids on their own.

Hi. First of all, Overheard I hear you, and yes, I probably could have phrased my question better, but I think most people know what I mean. Sorry. To the other replies – thank you for understanding. I really thought I’d be grilled for posting my whinge, but you’ve shown that people do understand and do care.

I agree, as it seems that wherever you go – people seem to be less likely to assist, for fear of being sued. Influenced by American TV shows I suspect! I certainly didn’t expect it to be the featured post, so it’s good to see people speaking in general terms about society, and people in Canberra in general.

Anyway, it’s time to finish building the rabbit pen in the shed before dinner. The life of a single mum; there’s nothing you can’t do, except control an uncontrollable two year old on an escalator !

mischief on a grand scale said :

I think in this day and age many people fear the repercussions of coming to the aid of another person, especially when a child is involved. I have witnessed a person stop a child sliding face first down the travelators at the Canberra Centre just to watch a very angry mother call security and to accuse this person of being a pedophile.
It is a case of political correctness gone mad… but sadly I think we will probably see more of these situations arise due to the way society has evolved.

I would have helped, I hate it when you see an situation arising and people stop and stare, but no one will help. But I guess we all just have to ask ourselves what is coming of society today?

Exactly. As a 30-something male if I go anywhere near a child I feel like someone is going to accuse me of something… forget restraining a child who was going to get on the escalators! I’d be locked up for that, I’m sure.

This is not a Canberra thing at all, it’s the world at large – unfortunately the whole place is turning hostile, largely due to litigation culture, the culture of fear driven by media, and the cult of the individual (me! me! me! is all that matters). I help people when I see they need it, and I have been helped by people… but throw a child into the equation and things get very dicey.

That said, the young couple are judgmental arseholes, but karma will catch up with them…

Its becoming a “f*** you, me first” society. No one helps anyone anymore. Its evident everywhere, and the above story is a classic example. I was raised to always be polite and courteous, and to help those in need. I cant remember the last time I saw anyone stop to help anyone in need. It makes me mad.

When I was a 2yo terror many, many years ago, my mother used to put me on a leash, a child harness that allows the kidlet to walk around with the parent, but not make a dash or freedom at the first opportunity. I must admit though, as payback for being restrained, I would crawl and bark on occasion causing great embarrassment.

My sister did the same thing with her child recently, a boy just under two that like me, loved to break free. She was abused in a shopping centre recently by a mother (with a tantrum throwing, snotty-nosed little brat that was bawling and tearing open packaging in tow) for restraining the little tyke in that manner.

Missjill we’re not all unhelpful. Many people don’t know how to help. Some are afraid, others believe that another persons circumstances are none of their business.

As a parent of young children, I understand your predicament. I would have helped.

I think unfortunately some Canberran’s are becoming like the rest of the world where we put the blinkers on and take care of our own business. Because of problems with strangers taking off with kids, or being sued when they try and help, but drop the little one in the process – people are less inclined to help than they used to be. Quite a shame really.

I’ve been away from Canberra for over 5 years and man it’s changed. As a city, we seem so caught up in trying to be a bigger city like Syd & Melb, that we’ve taken on some of the negative aspects of those great cities. People mind their business more now – more and more is the charm gone Canberra being small enough for people to look out for each other more.

I would love to have helped had I been there, and most likely would have, but I’d also feel an instant pang of concern that I’d be in trouble for touching a strangers child.

I think in this day and age many people fear the repercussions of coming to the aid of another person, especially when a child is involved. I have witnessed a person stop a child sliding face first down the travelators at the Canberra Centre just to watch a very angry mother call security and to accuse this person of being a pedophile.
It is a case of political correctness gone mad… but sadly I think we will probably see more of these situations arise due to the way society has evolved.

I would have helped, I hate it when you see an situation arising and people stop and stare, but no one will help. But I guess we all just have to ask ourselves what is coming of society today?

I would have helped too. And no, your toddler is not naughty. They are exploring and doing what toddlers naturally want to do. Tney felt confident enough to leave you and run elsewhere. You had very little choice in the situation as to what you could have done. I suspect the young couple may be parents that believe their child would never be naughty… And how many parents are like that are amazing. Children should never be labeled like that.

If I was their I would definitely have helped.

I also have a two year old, with a wife, and sometimes you could still use help.

Sorry about your experience.

I like to think that those two unhelpfuls are the minority.

Keep your head up and forget what they said. I’m sure you are doing a great job.

“Are all Canberrans this unhelpful?”

That’s a problematic question with a very simple answer. As soon as you use the word ‘all’ or try to bundle every single inhabitant of a city into one amorphous mass, then the answer has got to be an emphatic and resounding ‘no’.

Your experience is a reflection of the attitude of the two people you encountered, not necessarily the other 328,998 (or however many we’re up to now).