Police speeding

pink little birdie said :

The firemen park in the Taxi rank at the Kambah shops when they go buy their dinner on a regular basis if the car parks up the back won’t fit the fire truck. Also the whole crew goes in the the ride to the shops incase their is an incidedent. I don’t mind when the any emergency service vechicle takes the taxi rank. but regular cars should be hit with a wrecking ball when they do that.

A little mild inconvinence is totally worth having the Emergency services willing to put their lives/safety on the line when it’s needed or get help to me quickly when I need it.

Sorry, I can’t go along with this. The police especially should be setting examples of good driving behaviour, otherwise it’s “Do as I say, not do as I do.”.

I can’t say that I’ve ever actually seen a cab on the Kambah rank. It’s one of those, like the Jamison rank, where there’s no work and no point waiting there. Nevertheless, it shouldn’t be used for any vehicles but taxis, save for genuine emergencies. Again, I make the point that the taxi industry pays for taxi rank spaces – they aren’t just painted off and set aside like disabled spots or bus stops.

Skyring said :

buzz819 said :

Skyring said :

I haven’t seen the ambulance or fire service guys parking and having a cup of coffee. I have seen them attending to people injured or ill, or responding to a fire alarm. That’s fine by me.

The firemen park in the Taxi rank at the Kambah shops when they go buy their dinner on a regular basis if the car parks up the back won’t fit the fire truck. Also the whole crew goes in the the ride to the shops incase their is an incidedent. I don’t mind when the any emergency service vechicle takes the taxi rank. but regular cars should be hit with a wrecking ball when they do that.

A little mild inconvinence is totally worth having the Emergency services willing to put their lives/safety on the line when it’s needed or get help to me quickly when I need it.

justsomeaussie said :

Use the smart phone App waze. It gives you your speed and also creates a log of where you were and at what speed. If you were ever fined for speeding it’s been used in court to prove innocence.

Given the iphone app which I use for cycling to and from work sometimes has me doing 77 km/h, I’m not too sure I’d rely on that one in a court of law. The thing even has me doing different distances, anywhere from 13.5 – 15.5 km when I travel the same route every single time

buzz819 said :

Skyring said :

For buying a cup of coffee???? Do you seriously think that’s what the legislators actually had in mind when framing the law?

If the cops are engaged on emergency or even routine work, and there’s no other convenient spaces, fine. But when it’s for their own personal convenience, then it’s not reasonable to park illegally.

Of course, police folk may see things differently to the rest of us.

The Police car is part of their equipment, they still need to be able to respond to incidents at short notice, they can not be expected to have to run three blocks just to get to their car because YOU think they should not park in the taxi rank.

That is why it states reasonable, do you get upset when the Ambo’s or the firies park there? I know they do, have seen it with my own eyes.

I haven’t seen the ambulance or fire service guys parking and having a cup of coffee. I have seen them attending to people injured or ill, or responding to a fire alarm. That’s fine by me.

Of course, police should have ready access to their vehicle at all times. But please, could you address the point I raised about coffee and the intentions of the legislators?

What is more important: coffee or access to the vehicle? I don’t think that there is any over-riding requirement that police drink espresso coffee, and if you believe there is, then what is wrong with Mcdonald’s drive-through? That’s only a hundred metres away, there’s no need to get out of the police vehicle, and the coffee isn’t bad.

Do you think that the need for barista coffee is so vital that the police need to break the law to get it?

Or do you think police are always in the right?

At the end of the day Police are required to obey the posted speed limits like everyone else. Unless they are on urgent duty, where they are granted an exemption under Road Rule 305. AFP have a SOP in place (in response to the Clea Rose incident) whereby they have to get authorisation from a the duty sargent prior to undertaking urgent duty. Commonsense dictates the use of warning lights unless it isnt appropriate at the time.

I can see how the OP is annoyed at the sight of a police vehicle obviously speeding, hitting the brakes before the speed camera. They are required to set an example for everyone in terms of obeying the law. They are required to have whole of life integrity as well. Simple really. The best thign the OP can do is if s/he sees this happening again, is to note the rego number and let CPO ACT know.

matt31221 said :

I say let them. It sets a precedent for all of us to do the same without reprimand.

I’m not a legal expert, but I believe that ‘I heard the police do it so I thought that meant I could do it too’ is not going to carry a large amount of persuasive weight when contesting a speeding fine (or indeed many other legal penalties).

shmay02 said :

Did it ever occur to you that they may have been responding to a semi-urgent job and didn’t want to notify the offenders in advance with blazing lights and sirens. They won’t call a job code 2 i.e. lights and sirens unless someone’s life is in danger. This is normal and smart police procedure. Also, by slowing for the camera for that few seconds it means that they wouldn’t have to waste time down the track submitting reports to explain why they were speeding. If something turns to shit all of a sudden in your worlld … who will you be calling???

WTF? “Semi-urgent” is bulls***, either it’s urgent or it’s not, they were on the parkway, so obviously not near the scene of this supposed crime, or at least not near enough that flashing lights would be a problem. I’m not one for vilifying the police either, but I don’t go making up shite excuses when they’re obviously not playing by the rules. And chill out on the ‘?’s, they make you look a crazy person.

Did it ever occur to you that they may have been responding to a semi-urgent job and didn’t want to notify the offenders in advance with blazing lights and sirens. They won’t call a job code 2 i.e. lights and sirens unless someone’s life is in danger. This is normal and smart police procedure. Also, by slowing for the camera for that few seconds it means that they wouldn’t have to waste time down the track submitting reports to explain why they were speeding. If something turns to shit all of a sudden in your worlld … who will you be calling???

NoImRight said :

Maybe his chips were getting cold?

Chips? Chips have too many vertices.

Maybe his chips were getting cold?

Skyring said :

buzz819 said :

Skyring said :

Of course, if there is a genuine emergency and people are at risk, then good on them. But I’ve spent far too many nights sitting on the taxi rank at Manuka of an evening, watching marked and unmarked police cars park on the rank, the occupants stroll to My Cafe and stroll back with hot coffees, to believe that policefolk feel that the law applies to them in the same way as it does to everyone else. If they know they can get away with minor stuff, they do it, because few people lodge an official complaint, and if they do most likely the cops can come up with some plausible bullshit.

skyring, rule 307 of the Australian Road Rules;

307 Stopping and parking exemption for police and emergency vehicles and authorised persons

(1) A provision of Part 12 (parking zones) does not apply to the driver of a police vehicle or emergency vehicle if, in the circumstances:
(a) the driver is taking reasonable care, and
(b) it is reasonable that the provision should not apply.

For buying a cup of coffee???? Do you seriously think that’s what the legislators actually had in mind when framing the law?

It’s rude and unreasonable to disrupt the taxi rank. It inconveniences the cabbies to have to work around a police car parked in the middle of a rank of cabs slowly moving up as passengers arrive and are driven away, and it takes a space away from the rank, which all too often already has private cars stealing a free park. The taxi industry pays a lot of money for rank spaces, and it’s an irritation to see them taken up by other vehicles.

If the cops are engaged on emergency or even routine work, and there’s no other convenient spaces, fine. But when it’s for their own personal convenience, then it’s not reasonable to park illegally.

Of course, police folk may see things differently to the rest of us.

The Police car is part of their equipment, they still need to be able to respond to incidents at short notice, they can not be expected to have to run three blocks just to get to their car because YOU think they should not park in the taxi rank.

That is why it states reasonable, do you get upset when the Ambo’s or the firies park there? I know they do, have seen it with my own eyes.

Some years ago, late at night, I saw a police car come screaming out of their parking area behind the court buildings and get _massively_ sideways on to London Cct, turning right across the oncoming lane.

It seems sometimes that there is a thin blue line, not between citizens and anarchy, but between policing and rebellion. Similar phenomenon with the elaborately painted police utes seen particularly around SummerNats. I trust and strongly hope that, in their training and professional development, police officers have some more philosophical conversations about the psychological and sociological contortions required for their unique position in society.

buzz819 said :

Skyring said :

Of course, if there is a genuine emergency and people are at risk, then good on them. But I’ve spent far too many nights sitting on the taxi rank at Manuka of an evening, watching marked and unmarked police cars park on the rank, the occupants stroll to My Cafe and stroll back with hot coffees, to believe that policefolk feel that the law applies to them in the same way as it does to everyone else. If they know they can get away with minor stuff, they do it, because few people lodge an official complaint, and if they do most likely the cops can come up with some plausible bullshit.

skyring, rule 307 of the Australian Road Rules;

307 Stopping and parking exemption for police and emergency vehicles and authorised persons

(1) A provision of Part 12 (parking zones) does not apply to the driver of a police vehicle or emergency vehicle if, in the circumstances:
(a) the driver is taking reasonable care, and
(b) it is reasonable that the provision should not apply.

For buying a cup of coffee???? Do you seriously think that’s what the legislators actually had in mind when framing the law?

It’s rude and unreasonable to disrupt the taxi rank. It inconveniences the cabbies to have to work around a police car parked in the middle of a rank of cabs slowly moving up as passengers arrive and are driven away, and it takes a space away from the rank, which all too often already has private cars stealing a free park. The taxi industry pays a lot of money for rank spaces, and it’s an irritation to see them taken up by other vehicles.

If the cops are engaged on emergency or even routine work, and there’s no other convenient spaces, fine. But when it’s for their own personal convenience, then it’s not reasonable to park illegally.

Of course, police folk may see things differently to the rest of us.

Skyring said :

Deckard said :

If a cop doing a few k’s over the limit is the biggest worry we have in our police force then we live in a pretty lucky place…

It’s not the biggest worry, but it is symptomatic of the way the cops are perceived. Able to speed, park anywhere and generally make pigs of themselves. Whether or not they are attending to police business.

Of course, if there is a genuine emergency and people are at risk, then good on them. But I’ve spent far too many nights sitting on the taxi rank at Manuka of an evening, watching marked and unmarked police cars park on the rank, the occupants stroll to My Cafe and stroll back with hot coffees, to believe that policefolk feel that the law applies to them in the same way as it does to everyone else. If they know they can get away with minor stuff, they do it, because few people lodge an official complaint, and if they do most likely the cops can come up with some plausible bullshit.

The same way I do whenever I get caught breaking some minor rule.

I wouldn’t worry too much about speeding. On a good road in a well-equipped car with a well-trained driver, it’s not really a safety issue. What concerns me is the tailgating. That’s just stupid.

skyring, rule 307 of the Australian Road Rules;

307 Stopping and parking exemption for police and emergency vehicles and authorised persons

(1) A provision of Part 12 (parking zones) does not apply to the driver of a police vehicle or emergency vehicle if, in the circumstances:
(a) the driver is taking reasonable care, and
(b) it is reasonable that the provision should not apply.

So he wanted to avoid the extra paperwork by not tripping the speed camera, so what? Geez I’d do the same!

couple of things dude…..

it is not simply another vehicle even if the blues & 2’s aren’t flashing. Its a police car. Not granny in her Corolla.

Your description of the johnny hoppers as ‘the idiot’, ‘ the bonehead’ etc – well you are clearly coming from a position of little respect anyway, so its hardly an issue that your ‘respect’ is going to take a further dive – its not exactly starting at a high point in the first place is it ? The rest of your whinge would seem to confirm this.

I am always amazed at those out there who think that coppers should never ever EVER be in a hurry to respond to something. Do you have a police radio ? Do you even know 2/5ths of 5/8ths of bugger-all about police responses ?

Methinks not. Methinks that you are just another tosser who loves to crawl along in the passing lane.

Deckard said :

If a cop doing a few k’s over the limit is the biggest worry we have in our police force then we live in a pretty lucky place…

It’s not the biggest worry, but it is symptomatic of the way the cops are perceived. Able to speed, park anywhere and generally make pigs of themselves. Whether or not they are attending to police business.

Of course, if there is a genuine emergency and people are at risk, then good on them. But I’ve spent far too many nights sitting on the taxi rank at Manuka of an evening, watching marked and unmarked police cars park on the rank, the occupants stroll to My Cafe and stroll back with hot coffees, to believe that policefolk feel that the law applies to them in the same way as it does to everyone else. If they know they can get away with minor stuff, they do it, because few people lodge an official complaint, and if they do most likely the cops can come up with some plausible bullshit.

The same way I do whenever I get caught breaking some minor rule.

I wouldn’t worry too much about speeding. On a good road in a well-equipped car with a well-trained driver, it’s not really a safety issue. What concerns me is the tailgating. That’s just stupid.

If you have a problem with how a police vehicle is being driven, provide the feedback to the guy in charge of the traffic police. He is actually fair dinkum and will act on your feedback if it passes his bs filter

Speeding police cars and armed security guards. Must be a pretty quiet weekend out there for people wanting to post stories.

If a cop doing a few k’s over the limit is the biggest worry we have in our police force then we live in a pretty lucky place…

This is terrible, really terrible. A non-certified check by a person who lacks any expertise in speed checking reveals a Police car speeding.

In fact its so terrible you weren’t able to get the registration.

I would complain, pointing out your non-certified check of a vehicle you can’t identify. I’d probably write to the GG and the Queen as well. I hope the people (are you sure they were Police…or that they exist?) are publicly executed. This is a travesty.

There are Police weeping worldwide for the loss of respect you feel. Geez, I’d protest outside the Assembly too.

Put up a sign that says ‘Police speed’ but just have the caveat ‘but I don’t know who and I can’t prove it to any reasonable standard’. I mean you did have GPS though, They are incredibly accurate. I mean right down to the nearest suburb in some cases

creative_canberran said :

During the 2003 firestorm, an AFP vehicle was speeding through suburban streets to refuel. The vehicle was displaying beacons (official term for lights) and the sirens were on. Another car pulled out in front and there was a collision. The court found that even though there were massive demands on the police during the fires and there was a need to refuel quickly, there was insufficient reason to break the posted speed limit. The driver. a senior officer, was found negligent. The negligence of the other driver who pulled out though resulted in a discount.

It was actually on Adelaide Avenue and the Police Officer was using the shoulder to drive on, when a car pulled over to stop, thus causing the collision, it was found that the Police Officer was at fault in the collision. But you were close in retelling the story, besides all the points really.

Tooks: 🙂

So how many hours of advanced training are required before a new young officer is allowed to ignore the posted speed limit? 3 hours? 6 hours? Do they also have to get 80% or better on a multiple choice test?

After that I’m sure there is no reason they need to drive at the limit anymore. They have had rigorous training.

I mean without those few hours of in-car training, no mere mortal can expect to safely handle a car at even 1km/h over the posted limit.

During the 2003 firestorm, an AFP vehicle was speeding through suburban streets to refuel. The vehicle was displaying beacons (official term for lights) and the sirens were on. Another car pulled out in front and there was a collision. The court found that even though there were massive demands on the police during the fires and there was a need to refuel quickly, there was insufficient reason to break the posted speed limit. The driver. a senior officer, was found negligent. The negligence of the other driver who pulled out though resulted in a discount.

justsomeaussie said :

Use the smart phone App waze. It gives you your speed and also creates a log of where you were and at what speed. If you were ever fined for speeding it’s been used in court to prove innocence.

Unless you can point to a case of this happening in Australia, I’d have to call bullshit.

farq said :

ex-vectis: You know if you or I used a mobile phone while speeding on the parkway it would be dangerous, it does not matter that etheir of us have been driving fir 20years.

But a 23yr old police officer has done a couple of days training course in golbourne on ‘advanced’ driving so it safe for them to drive how they want.

I assume this is one of your famous trolling efforts, as no one is stupid enough to think that ACT police train in Goulburn and everyone knows how to spell Goulburn.

Should the police car have been speeding? Probably not. Was he actually speeding? Maybe not. It doesn’t sound like he was driving at a significant speed for you to be sure, and again just because your gps says you’re doing 100kph doesn’t mean you actually are, nor does the car slowing for the speed camera, seen may people doing the speed limit do the same. But I’m sure you have made yourself feel much better now that you have written up this pointless rant and writing pointless letters. If you thought it was that bad or reckless you would have taken the rego. There’s little point writing in to tell them if you can’t provide any details, all you will get in return will be a template letter.

justsomeaussie said :

Use the smart phone App waze. It gives you your speed and also creates a log of where you were and at what speed. If you were ever fined for speeding it’s been used in court to prove innocence.

I’d like to see that court ruling, was it in Australia, America, Mexico?

What court was it? I’ll check out the other mitigating circumstances around the dismissal of the offence…

Use the smart phone App waze. It gives you your speed and also creates a log of where you were and at what speed. If you were ever fined for speeding it’s been used in court to prove innocence.

ex-vectis, we must have only been a hundred or so meters apart. I have to say that while I was also very curious when he slowed down just prior to the speed camera, I was even more curious when he speed up again just past the overpass.

In any event, I just put it down to his being late for a meeting, change of shift or something similar. While the event did seem a bit odd, I still felt more comfortable having a police car go past me at speed than I do the P-platers, who do it everyday.

Primal said :

Mr Waffle said :

Ignoring the police-apologist “they’re allowed to speed!” brigade, it’s still hilarious that the cop slowed down for the speed camera…

Probably easier than doing the paperwork necessary to make the fine go away…

I was about to say the same thing. Really, the only part of this which stands out to me is the tailgating. Taking the OPs account at face value, tailgating was unnecessary. It it was urgent enough for them to speed, they could have blipped the lights/sirens for s second to get him outta the way.

Although, different people have different opinions about what is a safe distance…

ex-vectis said :

BenMac said :

Anyway, BenMac, I think you are wrong about the dangerous Police driving. The road law Exemption for drivers of police vehicles states that they can go above the speed limit but must display a red or blue flashing light and be sounding an alarm if it is equiped with them. In addition, if he was responding to a call why try to intimidate me by sniffing my backside and why slow down for the camera?

See you would have a lot more credibility if you actually researched what you are having drama’s with. I have no idea why the Police officer was speeding, or how fast they were going, or how slow you were going. The reason for my responding to an obvious troll is simply to point out that when you try to be right, ensure that you are actually right, or you will look like a real knob.

Here we go, Australian Road Rules, rule 305:

Exemption for drivers of police vehicles
305 Exemption for drivers of police vehicles

(1) A provision of the Australian Road Rules does not apply to the driver of a police vehicle if:
(a) in the circumstances:
(i) the driver is taking reasonable care, and
(ii) it is reasonable that the provision should not apply, and
(b) if the vehicle is a motor vehicle that is moving-the vehicle is displaying a blue or red flashing light or sounding an alarm.
Note: “Motor vehicle” and “police vehicle” are defined in the dictionary.

So yes, it does plainly say there, you have to had emergency lights or siren, but then you have to keep reading the next paragraph, obviously you left out that paragraph because you did not like it:

(2) Subrule (1) (b) does not apply to the driver if, in the circumstances, it is reasonable:
(a) not to display the light or sound the alarm, or
(b) for the vehicle not to be fitted or equipped with a blue or red flashing light or an alarm.

So, a Police car does not have to have lights or sirens on under reasonable circumstances, no point letting the crooks no they are coming now is it?

So did you get the registration of the vehicle and pass it on?

farq said :

ex-vectis: You know if you or I used a mobile phone while speeding on the parkway it would be dangerous, it does not matter that etheir of us have been driving fir 20years.

But a 23yr old police officer has done a couple of days training course in golbourne on ‘advanced’ driving so it safe for them to drive how they want.

Farq, you do realise that ACT Police do not train with NSW Police right? They do their training in the ACT….

I say let them. It sets a precedent for all of us to do the same without reprimand. Some of the speed limits in this town are way to low anyways.

It’ll be interesting to see what will happen in this scenario when the point to point cameras are installed.

BenMac said :

Even though their lights and sirens aren’t on doesn’t mean they’re not enroute to an incident.

Beside, a police car would be an authorised vehicle under Australian road rules, and just like being able to use a handheld mobile phone, they can also go above the posted speed limit.

Ex-vectis, I wish I had seen what else you have posted here before responding. After reading this, your “issue” with the tradie and the ABC disappearing, I can see you live a very stressed life. I wholeheartedly await your next problem to get off your chest, providing it doesn’t cause you a heart attack.

Hahaha. There was bound to be one. I assure you my heart is very well and I’m far from stressed. Indeed RA probably helps in both respects as I can get things off my chest with it. Funnily enough the tradies thing had a postcript – it leaked, so got another plumber in and he fixed it (while being polite and very friendly and very resonable $$$$).

Anyway, BenMac, I think you are wrong about the dangerous Police driving. The road law Exemption for drivers of police vehicles states that they can go above the speed limit but must display a red or blue flashing light and be sounding an alarm if it is equiped with them. In addition, if he was responding to a call why try to intimidate me by sniffing my backside and why slow down for the camera?

NickD – By letting the police management know about this I hope that they consider some more training for our Police personel. By letting the Chief Minister know, I’m highlighting that the laws that are passed are not being observed by those trusted to uphold them. Maybe the laws should be reviewed…?

Primal – A good point. Maybe the paperwork is obstructive and should be reviewed. By letting management & law makers know, maybe it could facilitate that.

BenMac said :

Even though their lights and sirens aren’t on doesn’t mean they’re not enroute to an incident.

Beside, a police car would be an authorised vehicle under Australian road rules, and just like being able to use a handheld mobile phone, they can also go above the posted speed limit.

Are they allowed to tailgate other drivers in order to intimidate them out of the overtaking lane?

Mr Waffle said :

Ignoring the police-apologist “they’re allowed to speed!” brigade, it’s still hilarious that the cop slowed down for the speed camera…

Probably easier than doing the paperwork necessary to make the fine go away…

Given that you haven’t sent your letter of complaint, much less received a response, what are you hoping to achieve with this post? It’s no secret that some cops drive badly.

Ignoring the police-apologist “they’re allowed to speed!” brigade, it’s still hilarious that the cop slowed down for the speed camera…

Policing is the the only job in the world where the the customer is always WRONG

ex-vectis: You know if you or I used a mobile phone while speeding on the parkway it would be dangerous, it does not matter that etheir of us have been driving fir 20years.

But a 23yr old police officer has done a couple of days training course in golbourne on ‘advanced’ driving so it safe for them to drive how they want.

Ex-vectis – Police are authorised or exempted from showing and sounding lights and sirens when undertaking urgent duty driving. Whereas fire and ambulance etc must.

Ex-vectis, I wish I had seen what else you have posted here before responding. After reading this, your “issue” with the tradie and the ABC disappearing, I can see you live a very stressed life. I wholeheartedly await your next problem to get off your chest, providing it doesn’t cause you a heart attack.

Even though their lights and sirens aren’t on doesn’t mean they’re not enroute to an incident.

Beside, a police car would be an authorised vehicle under Australian road rules, and just like being able to use a handheld mobile phone, they can also go above the posted speed limit.