18 May 2016

Patient privacy zone at Civic clinic extended

18 May 2016 | Michael Reid

The privacy zone around a health clinic in Civic has been extended to provide further protection for women accessing legal medical treatments, including abortion.

ACT health minister Simon Corbell said the extension, effective from Thursday, will include any areas accessible by the public around the clinic at 1 Moore Street.

The protest-free zone was introduced in March to ensure women could access medical services without being harassed, intimidated or judged by others. Unfortunately, anti-abortion protests had continued on the fringes of the zone within the line of site of people accessing treatment, Corbell said.

The extended zone will include Rudd Street, West Row and the alley way of Odgers Lane, and surrounding roads, footpaths, gutters, outdoor areas and other areas underneath a building’s facade.

Protesting or behaviour that increases emotional distress or may prevent women from accessing legal and medically recognised health procedures is prohibited within the defined protest-free zone between 7am and 6pm on business days to align with the opening hours of the facility.

The extended protest-free zone had been developed in consultation with key stakeholders, including the ACT Human Rights Commission and police, to strike a balance between protecting women’s rights to safe and legal health care and the rights of protesters, Corbell said.

“From tomorrow, if an individual is found protesting within the new area, ACT Health’s security personnel will notify them about the extension of the protest-free zone and ask them to leave,” he added.

“If the person chooses to remain, ACT Policing will be notified and penalties may apply.”

Information about the extended protest-free zone, including a new map, is available on the ACT Health website at: www.health.act.gov.au/consumerinformation/protestfreezone.

The Health (Patient Privacy) Amendment Act 2015 is available at: www.legislation.act.gov.au.

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Mysteryman3:02 pm 31 May 16

gooterz said :

Zan said :

Did you just tell us that it is his right to protest anywhere he feels like in public?

No I didn’t.
Google “strawman argument” if you want to understand your logical fallacy you just employed.

Zan said :

Hmm or could it be that a public foot path is much like a road? Make a nuisance of yourself and you will be moved on.

I’ve never seen the anti-abortion religionists obstructing the footpath – in fact they seemed to be being quite careful to not do so.

I wonder if you ever get sick of mis-representing reality to self-justify your beliefs?

From what JC posts, I don’t imagine so.

HenryBG9:37 am 31 May 16

Zan said :

Did you just tell us that it is his right to protest anywhere he feels like in public?

No I didn’t.
Google “strawman argument” if you want to understand your logical fallacy you just employed.

Zan said :

Hmm or could it be that a public foot path is much like a road? Make a nuisance of yourself and you will be moved on.

I’ve never seen the anti-abortion religionists obstructing the footpath – in fact they seemed to be being quite careful to not do so.

I wonder if you ever get sick of mis-representing reality to self-justify your beliefs?

Mordd4:25 am 31 May 16

Maybe they can try this instead: http://fusion.net/story/307072/copley-geofencing-abortion-planned-parenthood/ – in the USA protesting outside abortion clinics has been banned in most places for a while now, so they’ve taken it to the next level, technologically speaking.

dungfungus5:21 pm 23 May 16

HenryBG said :

madelini said :

rommeldog56 said :

If you are anti-abortion, you are anti-women. If you are anti-abortion, you hate women.

A women’s body is hers, to do with as she pleases.

It should hardly come as a suprise that those who want to snuff out free speech have their very own irrational dogma, which they want to ram down everybody else’s throats…..

gooterz said :

Acton said :

But there is something fascinatingly Orwellian about banning a protest on the grounds of a perceived lack of….tolerance.
In their fury to defend their own intolerance, it seems many miss the irony.

They are not being banned. They are free to protest, just not right outside the health centre and surrounding areas.

These areas are public spaces, to which the freedom to protest applies.
Today they are banning christians from outside the healthcentre. Next time it might be you.

gooterz said :

I also don’t understand why they feel their beliefs are more important than everyone else’s.

Are you referring to the protesters here, or supporters of Corbell’s law to impose *their* beliefs on all of us?

gooterz said :

This is quite clearly just one minority group using it’s position of power to lay the boot into another minority group with whom they hold a grudge. The abortion issue is just a smoke screen for the punters.

And this is a good point – the ACT Labor party has been attacking the christians (and mostly losing) for years.
The ALP just can’t handle the fact that its values are not universal values and are not shared by large segments of the population.

steveu said :

The “protesters” were within the exclusion zone this morning and I was happy to inform them of that. Unlike a lot of people I put my money where my mouth is as well as passive-aggressively ranting about it on the internet. I’ll be doing the same thing next Friday if they violate the zone again.

Oh, good-oh, why don’t you and your mates all wear distinctive-coloured shirts – say black shirts – when you roam the public streets looking for christians to persecute?

There is no such thing as freedom to protest. Freedom of speech yes not freedom to protest where and when you like.

Take dungers for example and his anti light rail stance. He has every right to disagree and protest but watch what happens if he were to set up a tent on Northborne ave. he would be moved on pretty fast.

And again nothing unique what so ever about having the right to process controlled.

“Take dungers for example and his anti light rail stance. He has every right to disagree and protest but watch what happens if he were to set up a tent on Northborne ave. he would be moved on pretty fast.”

No one has ever moved on the “protesting” campers outside Old Parliament House yet so I think there is a precedent about the issue.
You and your toy tram colleagues may think you can walk all over us but don’t push your luck too far.

JC2:45 pm 23 May 16

John Hargreaves said :

HenryBG said :

There is no such thing as freedom to protest. Freedom of speech yes not freedom to protest where and when you like.

Freedom of speech, freedom of free association and freedom of assembly are all recognised human rights which all add up to the freedom to protest in a public place.
Clearly, our comrade leaders are less concerned about Rights, and more concerned about enforcing political correctness.

HenryBG said :

Take dungers for example and his anti light rail stance. He has every right to disagree and protest but watch what happens if he were to set up a tent on Northborne ave. he would be moved on pretty fast.

You mean if Dungers broke a law and obstructed traffic, he would be moved on? True.
Funny thing is, these christians were breaking no law……which is why the ACT Supreme Soviet had to enact a new law to shut them up with.
Which is to say, your analogy was a bad one.

John Moulis said :

What I was saying nothing unique about protests being controlled in where they can and cannot protest or indeed where people may gather en-mass.

As for the odd location would have thought the main act health health clinic would have been the most sensible place for said clinic.

Agreed, there is nothing unique in this. Stalin used to control it pretty tightly, as one example.

I note you support the right of people to protest, so long as they do it where you would like them to do it. Maybe you could double-check your dictionary under “freedom” to see what it says?

So Dungers will get moved on for obstructing traffic if he were to protest on Northborne Ave? But isn’t that a public space? Did you just tell us that it is his right to protest anywhere he feels like in public?

Hmm or could it be that a public foot path is much like a road? Make a nuisance of yourself and you will be moved on.

Maya1231:09 pm 23 May 16

chewy14 said :

Shart said :

If I stood outside a church every Sunday harassing parishioners and telling them they were pedo’s etc… how long before I would get carted off by the police huh?

It is ironic that your right to protest outside a church is the precise right that you are signing away with your support for this anti-democratic measure against the god-botherers.

Please give examples of this happening; especially on an ongoing basis, such as the anti-choice campaigners outside the clinic has been doing. Maybe if this was happening this would need to be addressed too, but it hasn’t been.

HenryBG11:12 am 23 May 16

Shart said :

If I stood outside a church every Sunday harassing parishioners and telling them they were pedo’s etc… how long before I would get carted off by the police huh?

It is ironic that your right to protest outside a church is the precise right that you are signing away with your support for this anti-democratic measure against the god-botherers.

HenryBG11:04 am 23 May 16

HenryBG said :

There is no such thing as freedom to protest. Freedom of speech yes not freedom to protest where and when you like.

Freedom of speech, freedom of free association and freedom of assembly are all recognised human rights which all add up to the freedom to protest in a public place.
Clearly, our comrade leaders are less concerned about Rights, and more concerned about enforcing political correctness.

HenryBG said :

Take dungers for example and his anti light rail stance. He has every right to disagree and protest but watch what happens if he were to set up a tent on Northborne ave. he would be moved on pretty fast.

You mean if Dungers broke a law and obstructed traffic, he would be moved on? True.
Funny thing is, these christians were breaking no law……which is why the ACT Supreme Soviet had to enact a new law to shut them up with.
Which is to say, your analogy was a bad one.

John Moulis said :

What I was saying nothing unique about protests being controlled in where they can and cannot protest or indeed where people may gather en-mass.

As for the odd location would have thought the main act health health clinic would have been the most sensible place for said clinic.

Agreed, there is nothing unique in this. Stalin used to control it pretty tightly, as one example.

I note you support the right of people to protest, so long as they do it where you would like them to do it. Maybe you could double-check your dictionary under “freedom” to see what it says?

gooterz10:56 am 23 May 16

HenryBG said :

madelini said :

rommeldog56 said :

If you are anti-abortion, you are anti-women. If you are anti-abortion, you hate women.

A women’s body is hers, to do with as she pleases.

It should hardly come as a suprise that those who want to snuff out free speech have their very own irrational dogma, which they want to ram down everybody else’s throats…..

gooterz said :

Acton said :

But there is something fascinatingly Orwellian about banning a protest on the grounds of a perceived lack of….tolerance.
In their fury to defend their own intolerance, it seems many miss the irony.

They are not being banned. They are free to protest, just not right outside the health centre and surrounding areas.

These areas are public spaces, to which the freedom to protest applies.
Today they are banning christians from outside the healthcentre. Next time it might be you.

gooterz said :

I also don’t understand why they feel their beliefs are more important than everyone else’s.

Are you referring to the protesters here, or supporters of Corbell’s law to impose *their* beliefs on all of us?

gooterz said :

This is quite clearly just one minority group using it’s position of power to lay the boot into another minority group with whom they hold a grudge. The abortion issue is just a smoke screen for the punters.

And this is a good point – the ACT Labor party has been attacking the christians (and mostly losing) for years.
The ALP just can’t handle the fact that its values are not universal values and are not shared by large segments of the population.

steveu said :

The “protesters” were within the exclusion zone this morning and I was happy to inform them of that. Unlike a lot of people I put my money where my mouth is as well as passive-aggressively ranting about it on the internet. I’ll be doing the same thing next Friday if they violate the zone again.

Oh, good-oh, why don’t you and your mates all wear distinctive-coloured shirts – say black shirts – when you roam the public streets looking for christians to persecute?

There is no such thing as freedom to protest. Freedom of speech yes not freedom to protest where and when you like.

Take dungers for example and his anti light rail stance. He has every right to disagree and protest but watch what happens if he were to set up a tent on Northborne ave. he would be moved on pretty fast.

And again nothing unique what so ever about having the right to process controlled.

The lake protest with the tent was there for months.

JC12:11 am 23 May 16

HenryBG said :

gazket said :

steveu said :

I’m surprised more people aren’t protesting their right to protest.

No one is being denied their right to protest. Just their location to do so is controlled. Nothing unique to Canberra, nothing unique to the abortion debate either.

Persons protested illegally the Barr had a problem with it and banned it as much as he could. I’m sure if he could get away with banning it completely he would.
Down the track this ban has been extended. What’s to say it doesn’t get increased. Lots of places do medical procedures.

Given its Canberra protesters protesting at a Canberra facility and a Canberra facility I would say there is some semblance of it being unique to Canberra.

I’m still of the opinion that humans are humans and sometimes screw up. A screwed up abortion is birth, and a premature birth at a facility not equipped to deal with it is manslaughter by negligence.

The centre of the CBD also seems like an odd place for an abortion clinic, could it be that this has something to do with the sale price of the new apartments next to it?

What I was saying nothing unique about protests being controlled in where they can and cannot protest or indeed where people may gather en-mass.

As for the odd location would have thought the main act health health clinic would have been the most sensible place for said clinic.

JC12:08 am 23 May 16

madelini said :

rommeldog56 said :

If you are anti-abortion, you are anti-women. If you are anti-abortion, you hate women.

A women’s body is hers, to do with as she pleases.

It should hardly come as a suprise that those who want to snuff out free speech have their very own irrational dogma, which they want to ram down everybody else’s throats…..

gooterz said :

Acton said :

But there is something fascinatingly Orwellian about banning a protest on the grounds of a perceived lack of….tolerance.
In their fury to defend their own intolerance, it seems many miss the irony.

They are not being banned. They are free to protest, just not right outside the health centre and surrounding areas.

These areas are public spaces, to which the freedom to protest applies.
Today they are banning christians from outside the healthcentre. Next time it might be you.

gooterz said :

I also don’t understand why they feel their beliefs are more important than everyone else’s.

Are you referring to the protesters here, or supporters of Corbell’s law to impose *their* beliefs on all of us?

gooterz said :

This is quite clearly just one minority group using it’s position of power to lay the boot into another minority group with whom they hold a grudge. The abortion issue is just a smoke screen for the punters.

And this is a good point – the ACT Labor party has been attacking the christians (and mostly losing) for years.
The ALP just can’t handle the fact that its values are not universal values and are not shared by large segments of the population.

steveu said :

The “protesters” were within the exclusion zone this morning and I was happy to inform them of that. Unlike a lot of people I put my money where my mouth is as well as passive-aggressively ranting about it on the internet. I’ll be doing the same thing next Friday if they violate the zone again.

Oh, good-oh, why don’t you and your mates all wear distinctive-coloured shirts – say black shirts – when you roam the public streets looking for christians to persecute?

There is no such thing as freedom to protest. Freedom of speech yes not freedom to protest where and when you like.

Take dungers for example and his anti light rail stance. He has every right to disagree and protest but watch what happens if he were to set up a tent on Northborne ave. he would be moved on pretty fast.

And again nothing unique what so ever about having the right to process controlled.

HenryBG7:09 pm 21 May 16

rommeldog56 said :

If you are anti-abortion, you are anti-women. If you are anti-abortion, you hate women.

A women’s body is hers, to do with as she pleases.

It should hardly come as a suprise that those who want to snuff out free speech have their very own irrational dogma, which they want to ram down everybody else’s throats…..

gooterz said :

Acton said :

But there is something fascinatingly Orwellian about banning a protest on the grounds of a perceived lack of….tolerance.
In their fury to defend their own intolerance, it seems many miss the irony.

They are not being banned. They are free to protest, just not right outside the health centre and surrounding areas.

These areas are public spaces, to which the freedom to protest applies.
Today they are banning christians from outside the healthcentre. Next time it might be you.

gooterz said :

I also don’t understand why they feel their beliefs are more important than everyone else’s.

Are you referring to the protesters here, or supporters of Corbell’s law to impose *their* beliefs on all of us?

gooterz said :

This is quite clearly just one minority group using it’s position of power to lay the boot into another minority group with whom they hold a grudge. The abortion issue is just a smoke screen for the punters.

And this is a good point – the ACT Labor party has been attacking the christians (and mostly losing) for years.
The ALP just can’t handle the fact that its values are not universal values and are not shared by large segments of the population.

steveu said :

The “protesters” were within the exclusion zone this morning and I was happy to inform them of that. Unlike a lot of people I put my money where my mouth is as well as passive-aggressively ranting about it on the internet. I’ll be doing the same thing next Friday if they violate the zone again.

Oh, good-oh, why don’t you and your mates all wear distinctive-coloured shirts – say black shirts – when you roam the public streets looking for christians to persecute?

Evilomlap2:24 pm 20 May 16

rosscoact said :

BigRed30 said :

Masquara said :

switch said :

Nightshade said :

Does this apply to all medical places or just ones for abortions?

I guess it just applies to opinions that Stalin doesn’t like.

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/may/18/jk-rowling-free-speech-dissent-donald-trump

““If you seek the removal of freedoms from an opponent simply on the grounds that they have offended you, you have crossed the line to stand alongside tyrants who imprison, torture and kill on exactly the same justification.””

The people ‘protesting’ outside that place actively seek the ‘removal of freedoms’ young women have to attend the clinic to undergo treatment there, on the sole grounds that they are offended by the idea of abortion.

They aren’t offended by the idea of abortion, they believe that abortion is the murder of a human foetus whom they believe is a person with a fundamental right to life. At least debate what they’re actually protesting about.

That’s where the difference in opinions is. Those who don’t have the same views as the protesters don’t see it that way at all, so to them there is no use using that debate, because that is not what the debate is about at all. It is about personal beliefs and the freedom to choose, without being told that the ‘alien’ religious beliefs of others is what you have to believe too. They also don’t believe a foetus is a human yet; actually in many cases likely not even a foetus yet (at about 12 weeks, although that varies a bit according to which source), but still an embryo. “91% of abortions are performed in the first 14 weeks.”, according to the following link, so likely most would be embryos.
https://www.emilysvoice.com/get-informed/abortion-facts/

Hi Maya, long time no reply to one of your comments, sorry.

I have no problem with protests or what have you. My problem is young women being harassed who may or may not be even seeking an abortion at that place. These people can whimper about their beliefs whenever and wherever they like, they have no right to make anyone feel threatened or intimidated.

chewy147:55 pm 19 May 16

rosscoact said :

BigRed30 said :

Masquara said :

switch said :

Nightshade said :

Does this apply to all medical places or just ones for abortions?

I guess it just applies to opinions that Stalin doesn’t like.

http://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/may/18/jk-rowling-free-speech-dissent-donald-trump

““If you seek the removal of freedoms from an opponent simply on the grounds that they have offended you, you have crossed the line to stand alongside tyrants who imprison, torture and kill on exactly the same justification.””

The people ‘protesting’ outside that place actively seek the ‘removal of freedoms’ young women have to attend the clinic to undergo treatment there, on the sole grounds that they are offended by the idea of abortion.

They aren’t offended by the idea of abortion, they believe that abortion is the murder of a human foetus whom they believe is a person with a fundamental right to life. At least debate what they’re actually protesting about.

That’s where the difference in opinions is. Those who don’t have the same views as the protesters don’t see it that way at all, so to them there is no use using that debate, because that is not what the debate is about at all. It is about personal beliefs and the freedom to choose, without being told that the ‘alien’ religious beliefs of others is what you have to believe too. They also don’t believe a foetus is a human yet; actually in many cases likely not even a foetus yet (at about 12 weeks, although that varies a bit according to which source), but still an embryo. “91% of abortions are performed in the first 14 weeks.”, according to the following link, so likely most would be embryos.
https://www.emilysvoice.com/get-informed/abortion-facts/

I agree that there’s a fundamental disagreement here between people who will most likely never agree.
But surely all reasonable people should be able to see that no opinion on this issue is right or wrong, we’ve simply chosen an arbitrary point for where abortions are allowed up to and where the embryo/foetus/baby gains certain human rights. A point that could easily be earlier or later depending on your own viewpoint. People who see this as a black and white issue on both sides are part of the problem.

Acton1:56 pm 19 May 16

Simon Corbell said “From tomorrow, if an individual is found protesting within the new area, ACT Health’s security personnel will notify them about the extension of the protest-free zone and ask them to leave,” he added. “If the person chooses to remain, ACT Policing will be notified and penalties may apply.”

[[One of the two offences includes engaging in prohibited behaviour in a protected area. This will carry a maximum financial penalty of $3,750 and a maximum penalty of 25 penalty units. The other offence … will carry a maximum financial penalty of $7,500 and a maximum penalty of 50 penalty units and/or imprisonment of six months. http://www.health.act.gov.au/consumerinformation/protectedarea%5D%5D

Let’s see where this could take us. Why limit a “protest-free zone” to just around the abortion clinic because people will continue to protest on the fringes of the no-go area. The “protest-free zone” needs to be extended to keep protesters entirely out of sight and out of hearing. Include Northborne Avenue and Marcus Clarke Street. Make the “protest-free zone” all of Civic. No, all of the ACT.

What of people protesting in the “privacy zone” but about something quite different? Will they also be excluded?

A precedent has now been set. Lets build on this idea. If we don’t like people protesting about something, anything, anywhere we impose a “protest-free zone”. We must not allow ourselves to be offended by alternative – revisionist – heretical – xxxist views.

To stop protesters, impose a “protest-free zone” around the ACT Legislative Assembly. Around Parliament House. Around Simon Corbell when he is making Tram announcements. Protected areas will be mandatory round climate change conferences to shield participants from conflicting views.

Oh, what a utopia we could create by stopping anyone expressing views that are wrong because we don’t like them. Barr them!

I commend Mr Corbell and recommend he be awarded a hat like this guy, because he is of the same opinion and inclination:
http://www.azquotes.com/quote/728639

Shame on us for tolderating this. It’s almost worthwhile going along to protest against an anti-protest zone.

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