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Two boys and a pissing contest

nyssa76 16 December 2006 49

Everyone would have read or heard on radio about the continuing saga of EBA arguments [For teachers].

A brief “truce” has since floundered due to actions that the AEU calls deceitful – ACT DET requesting principals to give figures with 5% less high school and 10% less college teachers for the Secondary Transfer Round.

The Minister is adamant that these cuts need to be made in order to accommodate the AEU’s request for a 12% payrise (over 3yrs) for senior classroom teachers and a 9% payrise (over 3yrs) for younger (or less experienced) classroom teachers.

In a statement from the AEU’s website, Clive Haggar condemns the actions of the Minister and ACT DET:

“The ACT Government has now been completely exposed for the hypocrisy of its position in railing against the Federal Government’s Industrial Relations laws whilst at the same time using every avenue provided by those laws to delay and frustrate negotiations for a new teachers’ salaries & conditions agreement.”

Clive and the AEU members who attended Saturday’s meeting voted for more industrial action.

Yesterday’s CT (p.3) indicates the following dates for strikes in November (9:30am-12:30pm):

Monday 6th – All ACT Govt schools
Tuesday 14th – All ACT Govt schools
Tuesday 21st – Molongolo electorate
Wednesday 22nd – Brindabella electorate
Thursday 23rd – Ginninderra electorate
Thursday 30th – All ACT Govt schools

Why don’t they just formulate in the number of people 1) leaving the system and 2) retiring at the end of 2006 to cut out some of the 15% job cuts? Sounds too simple huh?

It’s like two boys having a pissing contest and neither will win.

UPDATE ED: The Canberra Times today has the story that the teachers’ union and Education Minister Andrew Barr are expected to announce today they will enter private mediation. If this is the case, the teachers are likely to call off next Monday’s strike. The Government has also insisted, and the union presumably agreed, that both sides accept the outcome of this provate arbitration in exchange for the matter not being taken to the Industrial Relations Commission.

UPDATE Private Arbitration will occur next week (the week before Christmas) and the AEU are stating that it will be a decision could be reached by mid-January. Please note, this is the reason for the lateness of the secondary transfer round and it will be released 1 week before teaching staff return to work (a week before the students).


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49 Responses to Two boys and a pissing contest
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Rog Rog 1:37 pm 15 Dec 06

Not exactly…

Rog Rog 1:36 pm 15 Dec 06

Ha ha ha

Thumper Thumper 1:13 pm 15 Dec 06

Hehehe…

Hasdrubahl Hasdrubahl 1:03 pm 15 Dec 06

You have been with this man when he wanks? I think that should be private.

Rog Rog 12:54 pm 15 Dec 06

OK, quite a few people have said that Clive Haggar is a ‘shifty looking dude’ a ‘childish twit’ and a ‘wanker’. I’ve got to agree wholeheartedly with all those coments. Believe me, i KNOW them to be true

nyssa76 nyssa76 5:25 pm 02 Nov 06

JTK, if she doesn’t have an offer, tell her to look at the private schools – teachers.on.net

She’ll get more money and most likely be permanent asap. Plus, she can apply to schools closer to home.

With the uncertainty over teacher positions, she might not get anything other than a contract for 2007 and THEN be given permanency if she has excellent contract reports.

I think it is a disgrace that with her ranking (the highest to those who don’t know) she isn’t made permanent.

Just goes to show they only want the arseholes.

GB – I wouldn’t have a prob if Clive didn’t respond like a child and if he hadn’t tried to ignore elements in the EBA to which he signed off on our behalf.

I’ll be glad when he’s gone – which won’t be until all his friends go….

James-T-Kirk James-T-Kirk 11:48 am 02 Nov 06

nyssa76 – No, she does not have an offer yet.

And I am with you, She works *way* more than she gets paid for.

Truth be known, she should be getting paid more than me. I finish work at 4, and am paid buckets. Sadly, the teachers can’t influence what they get paid. At least I can drop into the bosses office, have a short chat, and get about %10.

Thumper Thumper 9:11 am 02 Nov 06

Some beggars in India probably have to teach!

Absent Diane Absent Diane 8:49 am 02 Nov 06

some teachers in india have to beg. i guess that determines if they are doing a good job or not.

Thumper Thumper 7:54 am 02 Nov 06

No dramas GB

Cheers

Gerry-Built Gerry-Built 11:44 pm 01 Nov 06

Forget CPI (yes JB, I know we had this argument B4). 12% is what teachers in every other state/territory, both private and public teachers have already received in their EBAs (and what we asked – and continue to ask for) – without ‘offsets’! ACT teachers should be paid equal to other states – only fair! & We shouldn’t have to lose 10% of the teaching and Dept. staff to receive it as “productivity offsets” either. Johnboy wants to call teachers dishonest, look at what our ACT Govt. has done over the last 14 months (for all public officers)!

Com’n Vic, of course we have the interests of the “young-uns” (though we’d never use a term like THAT) at heart – we wouldn’t be there otherwise!!! But we don’t teach as a charity!!! We deserve (and expect) to be paid fairly (and 9% over 3 years by losing over 11% in ‘productivity offsets’ is not fair – SIMPLE! Would you work your current job if a)you could get more for doing the same somewhere else, or b)didn’t love it? The Govt is asking us to incorporate new curriculum
outcomes next year – and has removed the entire curriculum support team from the Dept. They have removed between 5-11% of teaching staff using a new staffing formula – we will all therefore have an increased workload, but will be paid less (in real terms) under the current ‘offer’ (Whatever CPI you wish to invoke)!

Anyhow, given the current situation, the whole looks set to be handed to the ‘independent umpire’ … And they’ll certainly be fairer than a lot of you…

Nyssa, I’ll go with my experiences (Re: Clive/AEU), and undoubtedly you’ll do likewise… just that I got no beef with him, nor you… “we are all products of our own experiences” after all. & I agree: “Do you want me to start “claiming” for unpaid work or just give me more than CPI? It would save you money. “

johnboy johnboy 11:08 pm 01 Nov 06

Oh there we go, the “Canberra Inflation” bollocks again.

the dishonesty of the teachers is what worries me the most.

Edumacated Edumacated 10:30 pm 01 Nov 06

I’m not quite sure what “sup” means, Vic, but I’m going to assume it means “drain”. CPI is running at over 4% in Canberra, but that’s besides the point. We deserve 10% per annum and more for the work we do. We are the profession that creates all the other professions. People who whinge about teacher’s pay have no understanding of what is required of us on a daily basis. I don’t do it for the cash – that would be stupid – but I do deserve a pay increase in line with what the Public Service gets. We are the front line troops, along with the police and the nurses. We deserve any increase we can win. I’ll happily give up pay increases for the introduction of flex time – we’d take the taxpayers to the cleaners.

nyssa76 nyssa76 9:25 pm 01 Nov 06

Vic, keep “your” money.

I teach because I love the job and love to educate. Your argument that it’s all about the money is bullshit.

I work 38hrs paid and another 22hrs unpaid a week. I teach 7 classes – 2 more than Govt and 1 more than most Non-Govt schools. That’s 200 students and I know all their names, their learning styles and their abilities.

Do you want me to start “claiming” for unpaid work or just give me more than CPI?

It would save you money.

Answer me this, if you think teaching is such an easy profession for “great” pay, why aren’t you a teacher?

Vic Bitterman Vic Bitterman 9:01 pm 01 Nov 06

4% per annum is more than inflation is running at – someone care to correct me?

So why are they (and some of you) NOT “Greedy teachers”?

Did you join this profession to make money, or to educate our young-uns?

Answer me that. You sup off my taxes. Why are you entitled to more than CPI than anyone else who sups off my taxes?

nyssa76 nyssa76 5:45 pm 01 Nov 06

I “naively” supported Clive until he personally attacked me over an issue (more like a question) I raised last EBA.

He also signed off on that EBA and then “advised” certain staff not to adhere to one section of it when it was necessary to address an issue in the workplace.

Yes, he’s so defendable.

Edumacated Edumacated 5:36 pm 01 Nov 06

I’m a young teacher and I know that the extra %1 p.a. pay rise given to the older teachers now will be my pay rise if I stay in the profession a little bit longer. I fully support Clive.

Gerry-Built Gerry-Built 4:34 pm 01 Nov 06

…also important to note, AEU is seeking 12% (over 3 yrs) across the board – for all teaching staff… not 12% for ‘experienced teachers’ (top of level 1 scale) and 9% for ‘beginning teachers’ (bottom) – which was ACT Govt’s last “offer”…

Gerry-Built Gerry-Built 4:09 pm 01 Nov 06

Nyssa “my opinion of my dealings with him are just that” – i absolutely agree 🙂 100% entitled to your opinion (I wasn’t decrying that, honest). Union is a system, and like every system not perfect for everyone (I was as affected by last 2 EBAs as you – being a newbie teacher myself). but it *IS* it’s members, not Clive and the exec. 😉

The majority just gets to look after themselves… That’s pure democracy 😉 and one day – we’ll be the oldies… heh heh heh (but not too soon I hope). I’m sorry you have a personal beef with Clive, but I know he enjoys majority support – and I’ll feel free to defend him thanks.

Thumper: no insult meant (check spelling and emoticon) – peace dude 🙂

Al: How could you be related to a teacher or two and still think teachers get 12 weeks holiday a year (is *THAT* what you were trying to say? – I may have missunderstood); they are not doing their job if they get 12 weeks holidays (and any teacher would tell you the same).

oh, & any teacher who was not signed on by 1230 after the industrial actions this year was docked pay! (as per WorkChoices) …and at every school, the Playground Duty was still in effect for lunchtimes! All non-union members would have been at work until then and all union members back as of then…

so, have I missunderstood your point, or are you simply wrong?

BTW: most teachers don’t think that strike action is the best action, but what other option do we have if we are to keep our education system the best in Aust (and don’t we deserve that) with teachers paid equal to those in other states?

nyssa76 nyssa76 1:33 pm 01 Nov 06

GB, no sorry.

Put in imput, went to all the meetings (at school and out of school hours), dealt with Clive and got a childish response.

Then there was something else – protecting older teachers.

I approached him as a union member, with a concern and wasn’t rude. He came back as a childish twit. He doesn’t like people who ask questions.

And I am not the only teacher to think so.

Don’t defend Clive. My opinion of my dealings with him are just that.

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