Road resurfacing in Mawson and Phillip

bundah said :

They had considered going over the top of the Lake George range but it wasn’t feasible so they went the concrete route below.There were many fatalities and serious injuries along the old stretch of road due to dangerous overtaking and poor judgement significantly attributed to the deceptive and undulating road surface which the duplication has greatly alleviated.

I remember that road well from childhood trips to distant relatives. It was a terribly narrow road given the traffic it carried, even as a kid it was nerve wracking when people would pull out to overtake.

c_c™ said :

bundah said :

c_c™ said :

La_Tour_Maubourg said :

Unrelated, but why doesn’t the ACT Government ever consider using concrete for roads? The Federal/Hume Hwy is immaculately smooth with no pot holes etc. Would be nice if the Majura Parkway would use this solution.

You’re joking, the Federal Highway is horribly bumpy where they’ve used that bright concrete surface, you can see all the cracks and fills they’ve put in the concrete. Hume Highway though is brilliant.

I’m guessing you’d never travelled along the Federal Hwy stretch past Lake George prior to concrete duplication for that was a bumpy,undulating and dangerous section of road.They used reinforced concrete due to the very soft ground surrounding the lake which was deemed unsuitable for asphalt.

I haven’t, though I believe some parts of it still exist so must give it a go sometime. That’s really interesting, I didn’t know that’s why they chose concrete for that stretch.

They had considered going over the top of the Lake George range but it wasn’t feasible so they went the concrete route below.There were many fatalities and serious injuries along the old stretch of road due to dangerous overtaking and poor judgement significantly attributed to the deceptive and undulating road surface which the duplication has greatly alleviated.

bundah said :

c_c™ said :

La_Tour_Maubourg said :

Unrelated, but why doesn’t the ACT Government ever consider using concrete for roads? The Federal/Hume Hwy is immaculately smooth with no pot holes etc. Would be nice if the Majura Parkway would use this solution.

You’re joking, the Federal Highway is horribly bumpy where they’ve used that bright concrete surface, you can see all the cracks and fills they’ve put in the concrete. Hume Highway though is brilliant.

I’m guessing you’d never travelled along the Federal Hwy stretch past Lake George prior to concrete duplication for that was a bumpy,undulating and dangerous section of road.They used reinforced concrete due to the very soft ground surrounding the lake which was deemed unsuitable for asphalt.

I haven’t, though I believe some parts of it still exist so must give it a go sometime. That’s really interesting, I didn’t know that’s why they chose concrete for that stretch.

bundah said :

c_c™ said :

La_Tour_Maubourg said :

Unrelated, but why doesn’t the ACT Government ever consider using concrete for roads? The Federal/Hume Hwy is immaculately smooth with no pot holes etc. Would be nice if the Majura Parkway would use this solution.

You’re joking, the Federal Highway is horribly bumpy where they’ve used that bright concrete surface, you can see all the cracks and fills they’ve put in the concrete. Hume Highway though is brilliant.

I’m guessing you’d never travelled along the Federal Hwy stretch past Lake George prior to concrete duplication for that was a bumpy,undulating and dangerous section of road.They used reinforced concrete due to the very soft ground surrounding the lake which was deemed unsuitable for asphalt.

I agree it’s far from perfect, but that compared to the coarse chip in Canberra is infinitely smoother to drive on and you don’t get the constant tyre roar.

c_c™ said :

La_Tour_Maubourg said :

Unrelated, but why doesn’t the ACT Government ever consider using concrete for roads? The Federal/Hume Hwy is immaculately smooth with no pot holes etc. Would be nice if the Majura Parkway would use this solution.

You’re joking, the Federal Highway is horribly bumpy where they’ve used that bright concrete surface, you can see all the cracks and fills they’ve put in the concrete. Hume Highway though is brilliant.

I’m guessing you’d never travelled along the Federal Hwy stretch past Lake George prior to concrete duplication for that was a bumpy,undulating and dangerous section of road.They used reinforced concrete due to the very soft ground surrounding the lake which was deemed unsuitable for asphalt.

Total waste of money , because the public’s cars become the roller to push the stones into the tar seal. Cars are not heavy enough to do the job so the chip seal just sits on the surface and peels back off .

Jethro said :

Onceler said :

I can understand budget constraints, but leaving urban roads in this state is ridiculous.

Am I correct in thinking that the resurfacing is done by private contractors hired by the government?

If so, you would assume that cleaning up afterwards is part of the job they are being paid for, and these companies are simply not doing it because it helps them cut costs/increase their profits.

The ACT government needs to start holding these companies accountable for doing a half-arsed job (eg. cancelling future contracts with them). If we must go down the road of having private companies completing public works, we should at least be ensuring that these private companies do the job they are paid to do.

I’d really prefer to see them move back to having a dedicated workforce employed directly by the government. All this contracting garbage does is shovel money to the owners and generally speaking screw the workers, all the while resulting in the sort of mess we see our roads in now.
At the very least they should maintain the capacity to do most routine maintenance, ie;filling potholes and resealing themselves and contract for major works as they come up.

La_Tour_Maubourg said :

Unrelated, but why doesn’t the ACT Government ever consider using concrete for roads? The Federal/Hume Hwy is immaculately smooth with no pot holes etc. Would be nice if the Majura Parkway would use this solution.

You’re joking, the Federal Highway is horribly bumpy where they’ve used that bright concrete surface, you can see all the cracks and fills they’ve put in the concrete. Hume Highway though is brilliant.

Just get everyone you know to log the issue with actgubs “Fix My Street”, they’ll do one of two things, change the way they reseal the roads or take down the website, knowing the actgub, they’ll shut the site down.

OR start a class action against the actgub for damage to cars, motorbikes, bicycles, yards, houses, other property, people, roos, dogs, cats etc. caused by their failure to reseal a road in decent manner.

Jethro said :

Onceler said :

I can understand budget constraints, but leaving urban roads in this state is ridiculous.

Am I correct in thinking that the resurfacing is done by private contractors hired by the government?

If so, you would assume that cleaning up afterwards is part of the job they are being paid for, and these companies are simply not doing it because it helps them cut costs/increase their profits.

The ACT government needs to start holding these companies accountable for doing a half-arsed job (eg. cancelling future contracts with them). If we must go down the road of having private companies completing public works, we should at least be ensuring that these private companies do the job they are paid to do.

I quite agree. They argue that chipseal is used extensively in other states as well, however in NSW from what I have seen they use a much smaller aggerate (stone) than that used in the ACT (where we seem to use blue metal from the look of it). If you do a quick search online all the chipseal studies state that the smaller the aggeregate the less tyre wear, better traction and the quieter the ride yet in the ACT we seem to get massive coarse stones on our roads.

It’s so frustrating that we can’t seem to change this. Everyone I know has complained to Tams at some point about the loose stones and coarse ride yet nothing seems to change. I’ve even written to Alistair Coe who stated that his preference was for hotmix (asphalt), but did not make any firm promises.

I would be happy just to see the major roads sealed in hotmix and money saved on the quieter roads.

It’s pretty embarrasing that the Federal Hwy changes from smooth hotmix to noisy chipseal smack on where the “Welcome to the ACT” sign is placed. I think that says it all.

Perhaps they should put a permanent “Rough Roads Ahead” sign right next to it.

I just don’t think it’s completed yet. There are no lines, only the little plastic flappy things as well as temporary loose gravel signs.
As incompetent as this government is, I can’t see this as a final resurfacing and the time frame between stages is just another indication of their inability to get anything right.

DUB said :

Am I glad this thread is still alive! Did anyone see how they’ve resealed Launceston street in Phillip (between Melrose Dr and Callam St)? I can see plenty of claims for chipped windscreens due to this shittiest work.
No sweeping, painted lines right over it, so two days later most of lane markings are gone. A drive on it is as rough as hell. Feedback through Fix My Street was submitted.

I cycle across that most days. Over 2 weeks later and I am no longer feeling that I about to crash every time.

Onceler said :

I can understand budget constraints, but leaving urban roads in this state is ridiculous.

Am I correct in thinking that the resurfacing is done by private contractors hired by the government?

If so, you would assume that cleaning up afterwards is part of the job they are being paid for, and these companies are simply not doing it because it helps them cut costs/increase their profits.

The ACT government needs to start holding these companies accountable for doing a half-arsed job (eg. cancelling future contracts with them). If we must go down the road of having private companies completing public works, we should at least be ensuring that these private companies do the job they are paid to do.

Just a few days after resealing some roads are looking rather shredded in that the stones have disappeared entirely and the original surface showing through. Very dangerous to motorbikes and bicyclists.

Hinkler Street in Scullin is really bad. No sign of any attempt to sweep up all the loose gravel left over from the resurfacing that was done weeks ago. Riding a two-wheeled vehicle through this stuff actually feels quite dangerous. I put in a complaint on the TAMS website. Waiting now for a response.

I can understand budget constraints, but leaving urban roads in this state is ridiculous.

DUB said :

Am I glad this thread is still alive! Did anyone see how they’ve resealed Launceston street in Phillip (between Melrose Dr and Callam St)? I can see plenty of claims for chipped windscreens due to this shittiest work.
No sweeping, painted lines right over it, so two days later most of lane markings are gone. A drive on it is as rough as hell. Feedback through Fix My Street was submitted.

It sure is. I was having coffee the other day on Townshend street the other day and there were stones flying and the noise alone of the cars driving by was remarkable. If they have to use chip seal can’t they at least use a smaller aggregate.
It’s a disgrace. Surely all the car dealers around Phillip are unhappy with it.

Am I glad this thread is still alive! Did anyone see how they’ve resealed Launceston street in Phillip (between Melrose Dr and Callam St)? I can see plenty of claims for chipped windscreens due to this shittiest work.
No sweeping, painted lines right over it, so two days later most of lane markings are gone. A drive on it is as rough as hell. Feedback through Fix My Street was submitted.

Jere13 said :

I’m sure dirt roads would be cheaper still, but they should also be considering community amenity. It’s all well and good to say that increacing the roads budget six fold is silly, but they obviously cut the budget by that amount when they moved away from asphalt/concrete.

Cost shifting is a policy dilemma as old as the hills. The Feds cost shift to the states, the states to local government, and they all attempt to cost shift on the citizenry.

The real issue is that the bastards will get away with what they are allowed. Returning the same party time and again ensures they do as they please, not what we instruct them.

La_Tour_Maubourg said :

Unrelated, but why doesn’t the ACT Government ever consider using concrete for roads? The Federal/Hume Hwy is immaculately smooth with no pot holes etc. Would be nice if the Majura Parkway would use this solution.

Because it’s even more expensive but it lasts up to 40 years (US studies claim) which is around 8 times longer than chipseal.

They will also never use it cause of the carbon footprint of concrete and the greens have a stong support base in the ACT.

JC said :

OP you answered your own question. As you said the cost is less and it is used on low volume roads. Well guess what Canberra roads even main ones are low volume. In Canberra due to low volume especially heavy vehicles our roads become porus before they break so chip seal is used to extend their lives rather than resurface with hot mix at 6 times the cost (using your costs). In Sydney the main roads get destroyed by trucks so need hot mix resurfacing but the suburban roads get seal.

So what it seems you are suggesting is increasing the roads budget by 6 times for no reason other than avoiding chip seal. I gather everytime your car needs a serviced you buy a new one instead?

What is silly though is where they use chip seal on new roads (except temporary allignments) where they just spray on a stabilised base like what the did on Glenloch interchange and more recently I the horse park drive extension. Never once seen that done properly. But that is different to sealing to extend the life of the roads surface.

I think you’re missing the point that chipseal also lasts less than half as long (and even less if it was a particularily bad job) not to mention the hidden costs of chipped windshields and paintwork.

I’m sure dirt roads would be cheaper still, but they should also be considering community amenity. It’s all well and good to say that increacing the roads budget six fold is silly, but they obviously cut the budget by that amount when they moved away from asphalt/concrete.

Unrelated, but why doesn’t the ACT Government ever consider using concrete for roads? The Federal/Hume Hwy is immaculately smooth with no pot holes etc. Would be nice if the Majura Parkway would use this solution.

OP you answered your own question. As you said the cost is less and it is used on low volume roads. Well guess what Canberra roads even main ones are low volume. In Canberra due to low volume especially heavy vehicles our roads become porus before they break so chip seal is used to extend their lives rather than resurface with hot mix at 6 times the cost (using your costs). In Sydney the main roads get destroyed by trucks so need hot mix resurfacing but the suburban roads get seal.

So what it seems you are suggesting is increasing the roads budget by 6 times for no reason other than avoiding chip seal. I gather everytime your car needs a serviced you buy a new one instead?

What is silly though is where they use chip seal on new roads (except temporary allignments) where they just spray on a stabilised base like what the did on Glenloch interchange and more recently I the horse park drive extension. Never once seen that done properly. But that is different to sealing to extend the life of the roads surface.

Zan said :

Maybe we should get GetUp to put pressure on the ACT Government or someone to organise a petition. I am sorry I can’t do it as I don’t have the wherewithal.

The only thing we should be asking GetUp to organise is their own disbandment.

Maybe we should get GetUp to put pressure on the ACT Government or someone to organise a petition. I am sorry I can’t do it as I don’t have the wherewithal.

We should elect a scholar of roads.

Very Busy said :

I don’t understand how the Director Roads ACT, the ACT Chief Minister and the ACT Transport Minister can possibly think that this is acceptable. Do they get around with their eyes closed?

…but I thought the transport minister was a green. Doesn’t that, in and of itself, make the government green?

No need to actually DO green things.

So it’s cheap and nasty (that’s certainly my observation) and yet, when the powers that be bother to respond to complaints about the level of rates and taxes in the ACT, the response is often along the lines of “Canberrans expect, and are prepared to pay for, higher quality services than elsewhere in Australia”.

There may be some services which truly are higher quality here than elsewhere, but there do seem to be quite a few exceptions to that.

If only we could express our objections in some democratic way. Perhaps we could incorporate some form of voting system? Oh wait, we just had an election, and nothing changed.

But you are right about the roads, the resurfacing is horrendous.

It wouldn’t be so bad if they would properly clean up the mess left behind. All the resurfacing that was done at the beginning of the year is still surrounded by loose stones in the gutters and median strips.

This seems to be something that has changed over the last decade. Previously the roads were properly swept and all loose stones were removed.

I don’t understand how the Director Roads ACT, the ACT Chief Minister and the ACT Transport Minister can possibly think that this is acceptable. Do they get around with their eyes closed?

They spray/chip [un]sealed Bangalay Crescent, Rivett a year or two ago and the road suddenly became so noisy to drive on that I felt genuinely sorry for the people that live along that road. The ironic thing was that afterwards ActewAGL came and ripped up a section at the south/west end of Hibiscus Crescent (to replace a pipe under the road) and they actually replaced the road with a proper developed-country sealed road so now there’s a really smooth quiet patch to drive on.

Interestingly, grip on the proper smoother bitumen, particularly in the wet, is substantially greater than on the spray/chip [un]seal, so much so that after they spray/chip [un]sealed the corner from Cotter Rd (westbound) onto Streeton Dr (Weston), nearly every time it rained, someone would lose it on the corner and use their car to knock down one of the nearby street lights (no, it wasn’t enough to observe someone else doing it last time it rained, lots of people had to wait for the street light to be replaced and then more rain so they could try it first-hand for themselves!). The corner was eventually resealed with proper smooth bitumen and, to my knowledge, there hasn’t been an issue since.

Still, if the ACT Gov’t was actually concerned about road/traffic noise, fuel consumption, wear/tear on vehicles, tyres, etc., they wouldn’t be causing us to be continually braking and accelerating and bumping along over speed bumps which are coming soon to a street near you.